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Child Protection Issue - What do I do??(60 Posts)
I need help desperately, I am so scared I will loose my children and I don't know what to do. This proberly isn't the right place but did not know where else to post as need replies soon.
The problem is with my dad and daughter.
He collects my daughter every day from school for me and has done for the last 3 years as I work, he picks her up and drops her straight off with me as I get home at 3.30pm.
Today he dropped her off as normal and told me she had been very naughty in school today (on-going problem with behaviour) and he told her off but she ran away from him and then fell over, he showed me the cut on her knee which is consistant with falling over (a small graze).
I cleaned it up no problem, spoke to my daughter about the dangers of running away, nearby roads etc. and left it at that.
I then got a call from school asking me to come in immediately.
Thinking it was over her behaviour today I asked if I could speak to them in the morning as had to get tea on and sort out my younger children (4 and 1 years old).
They then said they were calling about the 'incident' with my dad!
They went on to explain that 4 parents! had been into / phoned school to make a complaint about my dad assaulting my daughter!
They explained that according to the complaints my dad had been shouting at my daughter when she ran away, he then grabbed her arm and pulled her back with such force that she stumbled against him, he then continued to shout at her and pushed her into a wall.
I am gobsmacked! I have of course spoke to my daughter and she says no, she says he shouted at her, she ran away and fell. The same story my dad gave me.
I don't think she would lie to me, she normally likes 'telling tales' to get other people in trouble and she has not got a mark on her, other than the graze to her knee. No bruising / finger prints to her arm etc.
I don't believe my dad has done this but 4 different people, why would they say this had happened if it hadn't?
Who do I believe my dad or 4 strangers?
School have contacted social services who came briefly to my home and asked me to sign that my dad would have no contact with my children during the investigation or they would be taken into foster care! I have of course signed and will not be able to go into work until I find someone else to collect her from school.
I don't know what to do, I don't know who to believe, I can't believe this has happened but I can't understand why people would say this? I am in tears, I am scared I will loose my children.
Someone please tell me what happens from here?
hows it going op? do you just have to wait and wait to see what ss are going to do or say?
SD the private foster care rules do not apply to close relatives.
In the case of non unrelated children there is a requirement to inform SS after 28? days (I think) but it will not necessarily make it a CP issue. Its a monitoring
When I was looking after a non related child SS tried to class it as private foster care so they ^ didn't ^ have to be involved.
It certainly was not a private arrangement as I had never so much as set eyes on the child's parents, let alone arranged to look after them.
But I wont start a full fledged rant on this thread
Well I hope that you all get some help as to how to move forward.
Her mum abandoned her?
I don't have anything new to add but, if this were me, the things I would keep concentrating on are:
1. This could have been one person backed up by three friends. That would be entirely different to four seperate and independent people. One person could easily misunderstand events - I doubt four would all misunderstand in the exact same way.
2. Your daughter's injuries are consistent with your dad's version of events, which your daughter and other eye witnesses seem to be confirming.
3. The school have received an allegation of abuse. They are duty bound to report it to SS, who are duty bound to investigate and take precautions (not allowing your DD contact with your dad) whilst they do so. Once the school had received the complaint they would not have had the option to ignore it (and nor should they have).
4. You need to co-operate fully with SS. They will not take your DD into foster care unless they really feel there is no other option. They may also be able to offer you some help with DD's behavioural problems.
5. Trust your instincts.
Good luck with it all. I hope it all works out well for you & your DD.
To be honest there isn't enough information either way for anyone to know. The only people who do know are dad, DD and the parents who saw it.
Your hands are also tied to a certain extent in so far as SS have asked your dad not to have contact until it's all over. This is also a help to you as it gives you some space to see how things unfold.
If it helps, I can't see how you would lose residence of your daughter. At the end of the day this incident didn't involve you and you cannot be held responsible. The very worst case scenario is SS come back and say that your dad is no longer allowed unsupervised contact with your DD.
There are simply no grounds to remove residence from you and given that bio-mum has given DD up, you have PR AND defacto main carer. I cannot see any judge in his right mind would think that it would be in your daughter's best interests to remove her from your custody and stick her into care.
Sorry you're in this situation. Keep calm, cooperate with SS, don't speculate about horrible outcomes. My ex maliciously reported me when Dd fell over in the playground and cut her face. There was a thorough investigation but it wasn't a negative experience - I emerged feeling very positive and vindicated. As a previous poster said, best case scenario, you may get some additional support with her.
I think it it totally out of your hands now. You just have to let the process follow its course. It takes a lot of guts for someone to report
perceived chidl abuse so if four people made a complaint then SS will take it very seriously.
I wouldn't 'dismiss' the other mothers views. But they do need to be taken in context.
Neither the father nor the OP nor the girl herself are saying OPs father didn't have to restrain her. They are all saying there was indeed a struggle of some sort.
The OP's knowledge of her father and 'DD' must surely outweigh the conclusions being drawn by 4 onlookers at one given moment in time?
"she was kicking off when she came out of school" - i challenge anyone to handle this without a few eyebrows being raised by onlookers. I wonder if these 4 witnesses did anything constructive to help? I bet not.
"my daughters behaviour means we are not popular at school"
needhelp it's playground gossip - giving that she was playing up in class I imagine she was a handful in the playground.
I feel sorry for your dad - it's not like DD is saying he beat her is it - neither is anyone else except some random strangers.
It's a storm in a teacup and it will blow over - can you work reduced hours until then.
Diddl - I don't know, all the what if's are driving me mad now. Of course it would have been better to get her in the car and then deal with her later but it obviously didn't come into his head and no-one predicted this issue.
She was kicking off when she came out from school, the teacher this morning explained that my DD was screaming and thrashing about in the classroom as they were telling my dad what had happened to try and prevent him from hearing so it was abad situation from the start.
They have explained more about what was said but will not say who obviously. I am finding it even harder to believe as no-one I spoke to this morning knows anything about it, other parents in my daughter's class saw him taking her to the car, some saw him collect her but no-one saw this incident although they were not all watching his every move clearly.
ll31 - Do you really believe somone should be judged for 1 mistkae 20-30 years ago? I take it you have never made a mistake? He has never been violent since.
Deuchers - There was no infomal fostering arrangement, she was signed over to me whilst a lot younger, her bio-mum is a relative who lived with me. One day she went and never took her child. I have a residency order and PR but I am not her legal mother if that makes sense as she is not adopted, nor being fostered.
MrsDV, I'm confused about This is a voluntary arrangement so SS are not required to be involved.
My understanding is that if you look after someone else's child (unless you are child's grandparent or aunt/uncle) for more than a month, it is an informal fostering arrangement and SS need to be involved. My experience is having foreign children on a six-month educational exchange.
[Sorry to hijack, OP.]
What I don´t understand is why he was telling her off before she ran away?
Perhaps she wouldn´t have run away if not for that?
If she has been "naughty" in school & it has been dealt with-perhaps he needs to say nothing.
I think a lot of us, if we had got back a child who had run away would just get them swiftly to the car & home & not continue the shouting?
bizarre how the other mothers views are being dismissed as if they were kids on a playground- just because its your dad. who has been violent previously....
I have no profesional advice to add, but would err on the side of agreeing that it sounds to me like a group of four mums going in together, but making separate statements.
When i read your first post OP, i pictured a 4 or 5 year old child and thought hmmmm, excessive use of force by your DF at the very least there! However, now you have said she's 9, and has behavioral issues i can easily see what a tricky situation your DF was in. Having to 'manhandle' a 9 year old girl across a playground would not make comfortable viewing even if being carried out by a person trained in 'safe handling' of children with behavioral and anger issues. It is practically impossible to safely physically control a struggling child of that age if you haven't had any training.
I'm seconding the thought that SS will be able to give you and your DF some help, in fact, because of this incident. It sounds like he is struggling at the moment, and could do with support handling the young girl, not accusations.
So sorry this is happening - i'm hoping this has a positive outcome for you very soon.
my daughter's behaviour means we are not popular at school.
christelle yes it is. The op has a residency order from the court.
This is a voluntary arrangement so SS are not required to be involved. In fact they generally run a mile in the opposite direction.
Tbh it's why I gently nudge people away from these ad hoc, semi sanctioned arrangements.
But that is fr another thread.
Hang on op. You may get some help out of this (fingers crossed)
Surely you will be expected to call your dad, if only to explain then no contact and that he can't pick your daughter up from school until further notice.
So sorry about your situation. I totally understand how gossip and exaggeration could lead to reports like this. There is a dad at my children's small gossipy village school that is quite shouty and anti social and it is regularly speculated by a number of mums that he may hit the kids despite not actual evidence of such at all. Sometime people and see and interpret what they expect to see.
That said, at least with an investigation you can hopefully feel totally comfortable about your dads involvement, or lack of, and won't have constant nagging doubts.
I'd be really furious, one incident of a older gentleman disciplining a DC just like most of us in our 40's were disciplined by deeply loving parents. Investigate, what a waste of tax payers money and SS's time.
I'm not an expert, but I think it would take more than one 'pushing a challenging 9 year old' (if indeed that is what happened - which remains in doubt) for a prosecution to be brought. Social care are probably struggling just as much as you are to make sense of it!! With regard to whether grandad can see the other dc's - best to ask social care, they may be assuming that the 'no contact' covers all the dc's & you don't want to get it wrong.
Please try not too worry. You are still in shock. Don't even think about prosecutions or anything like that just now.
SS will bring you up to speed, when they talk to you.
I don't want to open a can of worms, but bear in mind, SS may want to speak with you re how dd came to be with you, as they may say, this could play a part in her behaviour as well. (not wanting to worry you, just pre-arm you so to speak).
You will need to check with SS, but I doubt your dad will be able to see any of your dc till the investigation is complete. If you mean grandchildren of other members of your family, then I'm not sure, but best to check.
I'm sure you can ring your dad-he's not seen as a danger to you. You will probably feel better if you speak to him, cos he'll be able to tell you what happened with the Police. And, your dad will probably be relieved to speak with you.
Try to get some sleep. Do you have a partner or any rl support?
If it wasn't ok for you to call him you would have been told not to.
Sorry i vanished suddenly.
The police have been to take a statement from my daughter and were then going to my dads, no idea what has happened as scared to ring him in case it's seen as notcoperating.
Hard to explain bigpants but i have not adopted my daughter and so not know to SS. Her bio mum basically gave her to me, it was very unofficial but i do have parental responsibly as part of the residence order.
The school do not usually tell my dad about her behaviour, they write in her book but today was a very bad day and they told him. He wouldn't usually tell her off either unless he is dealing with the behaviour at the time but from what I am told she came out of school kicking off so he didn't have much choice.
I just wish they could tell me more about what has been said or seen.
What if SS don't believe him or my daughter, can they prosecute on the witnesses versions? What will that mean in terms of him seeing her? Is he still ok to see his other grandchildren in the meantime?
When I complained to the school about a grandmother beating her 6yr old grandson whilst walking across the playground, they asked me if anyone else had seen it. When I said yes about 3 others had seen it, they asked them to make statements to the CPO too...they said SS would want as many different accounts as possible.
That's probably why there are 4 statements.
If your dd is not yours biologically,then you & she will be known to SS?
SS will not remove your dc, but they want you to keep them safe, as do you, while they investigate. It's a horrible situation for you all, but your dad will understand, & hopefully, the investigation will be soon, cos a young dc is involved, & can't be expected to remember exactly what happened over many weeks.
If you speak to your dd re the incident, try not to ask leading questions, or put words inher mouth.(Not saying you would).
I don't think your dad should be telling your dd off for behaviour at school. It will be a trigger for your dd-she'll have been told off in school, & then gets " it" again on the way home. Does your dad also speak re her behaviour on the way to school? Perhaps he knows her behaviour stresses you & is trying to help, but is becoming frustrated with lack of progress?
I'm not saying your dad did what has been reported, but I think he should steer clear of school issues, & you ask the school to either telephone you, or send a letter re dd's day at school.
You say she has had a troubled past & undergoing assessments. In this case, I would let the school deal with behaviour there, & you deal with behaviour at home. I personally dont think it's fair to tell a child with difficulties off for behaviour that will have already been dealt with at school-it's overload.
I hope things are sorted quickly, & please remember to look after yourself as well while this is on-going.
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