ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
to think this video may show that Esther Rantzen KNEW Jimmy Saville was abusing children...(169 Posts)
... And to think that if she did, ChildLine need to say publicly how awful that is...
Esther Rantzen was interviewed on Sky a couple of days ago, about the documentary which alleged Saville was a predatory abuser. I've just come across a video of the interview (click here) , and I'm really shocked by how she appears to duck the question "When did YOU know?"
It does seem that a lot of people knew about Saville, or had their suspicions, years ago But I can't help feeling that Rantzen's role at Childline puts her in an entirely different position to anyone else who may have known... She's a 'champion' for the organisation... But if it transpires that she kept silent about abuse, I think that's really appalling, and ChildLine need to make some kind of statement... Because if
even the founder of ChildLine keeps silent about abuse, for any reason at all, then doesn't that give a terrible message to all those children and adults trying to find the courage to speak out about what has happened to them, that everyone is keeping silent, and they are right to feel afraid and alone?
I find this very upsetting, and if turns out Rantzen did know, I think that is really shocking and outrageous... But AIBU? Do other people draw different conclusions from the video? And if not, could there be a good reason for her not to speak out?
i,m not blaming esther for anything i know you cant take rumours to the police but there were an awful lot of rumours he was a truly vile man who got away with abusing kids because of his status kids were treated very differently in the 70,s and 80,,s hopefully with safeguarding etc a celebrity will never be allowed to abuse their power in such a sick way again
Nd opinions and threads like these r exactly why no one said anythin in the first place if a celebrity woman felt she wouldn't be believed then no wonder the poor victims felt that way. Was it there fault too???
The reason why ER didn't speak up at the time is evidenced right here in this thread!!! Everybody's making out that it's somehow HER fault that JS did these awful things to those poor girls. Blame the woman.
Imagine if she HAD spoken out. The same thing would have happened - she would not have been believed and everyone would have said it was awful that she should say such things. Blame the woman.
She DID do something. She founded Childline. She realised something had to be done to change the culture of secrecy around abuse, to challenge the 'turn a blind eye' consensus that allowed these things to happen. She used her high profile and influence (which she didn't have to do, fgs) to initiate a sea change in public attitudes towards sexual abuse.
Of everyone involved at the time, she is surely the least to blame.......
Feel sorry ER is being slated, when she could have continued her pretty successful career, and not invested the time and energy into setting up Childline. She presumably made a judgement at the time - which was that rumour isn't proof - and did nothing more about it. That doesn't make her evil - I think we all know who the real evil person is!
I was a similar age to some of the victims at the same time, and life was different. There was a teacher (RS!!) who was known for touching girls legs whenever he got the opportunity. We all just avoided him, and took the p***, but I would never have mentioned it to my Mum. I very much hope that DD would have told me. My friends and I knew it was creepy and wrong, but not that it was truly wicked, and probably thought we'd have been in trouble for telling about him.
We have seen enough celebrity women shamed after such claims! To this day it still happens.
She wasn't in any more of a position to "take him down " than anyone else. God knows what stunts and threats be pulled to cover it up.
Don't underestimate how much women are disparaged and undermined now.
Stop blaming women for the crime of a man.
* if esther suspected she should and could of done more i do think though she should be commended for setting up childline*
I wish people would stop holding ER responsible. You can't take a rumour to the police and if you do, they can't act on it without concrete proof.
Don't underestimate a) how much women were disparaged and undermined in the 70s and even the 80s, and b) how extremely powerful JS was. He had connections to so many huge influential bodies: Freemasons, charities, hospitals, police.. Any single woman with only a rumour as ammo would not have got anywhere even if they'd tried.
The only person we should be pointing a finger at is JS himself and all those who KNEW FOR A FACT he was abusing children and did nothing. ER heard gossip at work. You can't take that to the police.
i am 39 so old enough to remember esther rantzen setting up child line and also old enough to remember jimmy saville in his hey day ie jim ,ll fixit the world was very different back then children were not beleived if they said they were being abused and just imagine if you were one of the poor kids jimmy saville abused everybody loved him jim ,ll fixit was the highlight of my saturday night viewing if esther suspected she should and could of done more i do think though she should be commended for setting up childline
socharlotte. I agree.
I think that says more about them than about the victims.
ER and JSP say they heard RUMOUR.I have heard rumours of UFO landings, and Elvis working at the chippy!
I would want some corroboration names dates places and maybe even witnesses before i potentially opened myself up to defamation suits against me.
Child abuse is a whole different thing nowadays, we view children differently. But not all of us. When I complained to my son'd school about a teacher bullying, a known bully with huge issues of rage and name calling kids (yr4), I was told by the Head that 'this is a man's career'! So we are still more inlcined to protect an adult than safeguard a child.
Look at threads on here where concerned people are called interfering.
YouOldSlag Many people are obsessed with the amount of money they imagine can be made from 'kiss and tells' - I'm going to describe this testimony as that because that's how some people would describe it.
They can't believe anyone could have a motive for speaking out that wasn't financially-driven.
That also goes for people who sue for medical negligence or H&S breaches. Some people imagine that being brain damaged during an operation or being crippled falling off scaffolding would be like hitting the jackpot - plus these lucky bastards are burdening the already overstretched NHS rather than trying to ensure their future care and that it never happens again
I think that says more about them than about the victims.
I've had someone on facebook (started a thread about it yesterday) saying it was for the money. Some people are stupid disgusting human beings!
LaVolcan- that's very true and it makes my blood boil. It's bad enough the victims were raped and molested. it's even worse when people don't believe them and say they are in it for the money. How cruel.
Seeker- that producer deserves to rot. It's collusion and it's enabling. Even in the 70s people knew it was wrong to sleep with 12 year old girls.
"There was a former (male) producer at the bbc on that programme admitting that he had first hand knowledge that Savile was raping a 12 year old (he even spoke to her on the phone while she was in bed with him - it was 'demeaning' to him apparently"
That stuck in my mind too.
And look at the number of people now who are saying that the victims are coming forward so that they can get money for telling their stories! Even now, when there is so much evidence coming out.
So I can believe ER and JSP when they said they couldn't do anything at the time.
I watched the video and all she is saying is that she heard a rumour in the office. That's it! She had no evidence. Rumours go around all the time, particularly about famous people, i would imagine that most if not a lot are untrue. People like spreading shit about, you can't call the police every time you hear a bad rumour about someone.
There was a thread the other day where the op said that she had heard that one of the dads in the playground was a convicted child molester, she was absolutely flammed and told to mind her own business. How is that different? According to some of you she should personally investigate him.
I think in this case its a lot of people looking back with the evidence we have now thinking that things in the past should have been done differently based on that, not what we knew then. Some people don't seem to understand that you can't base a decision in the 70s or 80s on info from 2012!
As for all those saying that they knew he was a wrongun because he was creepy, what a load of bollocks!
Oh sorry Bonzo, reading my post back, the second sentence of my earlier post is in fact directed at aqua, not you.
I do agree though that if anyone knew FOR a FACT i.e not rumour and gossip, then they were very wrong not to come forward and protect any future victims by stopping the abuse.
However, some posters on here have been blaming female employees such as ER and JSP when female employees in the 70s and 80s had the smallest voices of all. That, I feel is making scapegoats out of the wrong people.
Youoldslag - I agree - and in case you were directing your second point to me - I'd already been saying ER wasn't to blame for not reporting but the producer bloke who absolutely knew should be rotting in hell for not reporting it.
exactly, ER and JSP can't exactly blurt out names on This Morning or in The Sun can they?
They would a) be sued and/or b) jeopardise a possible future trial.
seems like some on here would like there to be a mass outing of those who are guilty in the most sensational way
we all want those who are still alive to be prosecuted but for it to be done the correct way so a trial can not in any way collapse and for others to be named and questioned if they have actively covered up for JS and others
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