Surely Jeremy Hunt has got to go???

(1000 Posts)
stillorsparkling Sat 06-Oct-12 08:35:00

Apparently he supports reducing the legal cut off for abortion to 12 weeks.

He's the health secretary FFS!!!!!

FreudiansGoldSlipper Sat 06-Oct-12 12:07:52

missymoo i am so sorry for all that you and your family have been through

you are right no women just has a change of mind there can be many reasons whey a termination is needed later on in pregnancy and the situation they are in will be heartbreaking

Jereny Hunt should fuck off and shut up

LineRunner Sat 06-Oct-12 12:12:35

Freudian: Jeremy Hunt should fuck off and shut up

Yes, that just about sums it up for me, too.

flow4 Sat 06-Oct-12 12:28:32

baby DoH figures show that 91% of abortions happen before 13 weeks. (Up from 87% in 2004).

This graph shows clearly (tho it's a bit out of date) that hardly any abortions happen late on. The 9% that happen between 13-24 weeks are either because women didn't discover they were pregnant until late, or because abortion is available in their health authority and they have to wait for an out-of-area referral, or for tragic reasons like those that missy describes above (so sorry to hear your story, missy sad )

There's no such thing as 'abortion on demand'. In my own health authority area, until relatively recently, there was not a single consultant who would perform one, and women had to travel to neighbouring cities/health authorities if they needed one.

ANY abortion has to satisfy the following conditions:
"Subject to the provisions of this section, a person shall not be guilty of an offence under the law relating to abortion when a pregnancy is terminated by a registered medical practitioner if two registered medical practitioners are of the opinion, formed in good faith -
(a) that the pregnancy has not exceeded its twenty-fourth week and that the continuance of the pregnancy would involve risk, greater than if the pregnancy were terminated, of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman or any existing children of her family; or
(b) that the termination of the pregnancy is necessary to prevent grave permanent injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman; or
(c) that the continuance of the pregnancy would involve risk to the life of the pregnant woman, greater than if the pregnancy were terminated
(d) that there is a substantial risk that if the child were born it would suffer from such physical or mental abnormalities as to be seriously handicapped."

We shouldn't forget that the original 1967 Abortion Act allowed abortion up to 28 weeks, and that was dropped to our current 24 week limit in 1990.

No-one has any abortion for fun. A woman having a late abortion has a heart-breaking decision to make and often a difficult medical process to go through.

Jeremy Hunt is clearly terrifyingly ignorant. Either he's a c*nt, or he's a puppet 'softening' us for another drop to 20 weeks - and in either case I think the country deserves a better Heath Secretary.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-19854465

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_the_United_Kingdom

YouMayLogOut Sat 06-Oct-12 12:31:55

The law should not be changed. This is a medical decision which is between a woman and her doctors.

getmorenappies Sat 06-Oct-12 12:44:19

I'm sure the fact there's a Tory party conference nextweek has nothing to do with this I do actually

it plays to the Tory hard line

YouMayLogOut Sat 06-Oct-12 12:47:43

It's the sort of thing I would associate with the fundamentalist "religious right" in America. I thought our country was more sensible...

BartletForTeamGB Sat 06-Oct-12 13:06:46

I'm not a GP but I am a doctor. We are allowed to have opinions!

randomswitch Sat 06-Oct-12 13:08:59

It is amazing how misinformed some people can be. I recently had a discussion witha women who forthrightly and angrily declared that no abortion should be allowed after twelve weeks as EVERY woman knows she is pregnant by eight weeks at the most. She clearly had no idea that not every woman has a regular menstrual cycle, and that many women go many months without menstruating (not unusual for me to have one or two a year). hunt is probably as ignorant as this.

The only plausible explanation for Hunt still having a place in Cabinet after the Murdoch fiasco is that he knows where the bodies are buried. He's a smug git who should never have kept his job let alone be promoted.

This government has no intention on doing what is right for women, or children, or anyone in any kind of need.

And of course a 12 week limit would be ridiculous. Even they wouldn't allow it to happen.

LonelyCloud Sat 06-Oct-12 13:13:11

I think 12 weeks is too early - yes, the majority of abortions happen before then - but if you don't realise you're pregnant right away, or have trouble finding a doctor who'll refer you, 12 weeks isn't all that long.

And that's before thinking about cases where abnormalities aren't picked up until the 20 week scan.

I also don't believe that any woman would take the decision to abort her pregnancy lightly.

BartletForTeamGB Sat 06-Oct-12 13:13:34

"But that was your choice. No one is goingto take that choice away from you. Surely you can understand that it would be barbaric to force a woman to go through that, if she didn't want to?"

There is no suggestion that the law is going to be changed in that regard. This appears to be a discussion of 'social abortion'.

bellabreeze Sat 06-Oct-12 13:14:24

To tell the truth, i was very glad to hear this, it is too late in my opinion, babies have been born and survived at that age and it's just too old. I don't think its only about the woman, it's about the unborn child aswell.. letting the baby grow for that long only to end its life is hardly fair

jellybeans Sat 06-Oct-12 13:15:42

It's very easy to have a view against abortion if you are a man, have not been raped, are not in extreme poverty, not a teenager who is pregnant, not found out at the 20 week scan your baby has no brain etc etc. I have been in some of these sad positions and made a different choice both times. Before being faced with it I also had no idea, was against certain things etc because I had had the luxury of never being faced with it until that time. I can tell you that what you think you may do and what you actually do may very well be different. So you have to trust that other women going through hell in horrible situations can choose what is best with all the facts about their specific situation not what some outsider who has never ever had to face such horror thinks they should do. Giving birth to a baby who won't live or is stillborn post 20 weeks is horrific. I have done it twice. Who would go through that unless there was a dire reason.

DilysPrice Sat 06-Oct-12 13:17:51

I think he's a twat, and I disagree with him on this, but I don't think that his views in abortion (which have been well known for some time) disqualify him from being health secretary - it's always been legislated on as a matter of inidividual conscience.

His views on homeopathy however...,

PeshwariNaan Sat 06-Oct-12 13:20:25

bellabreeze, babies have NOT been born and survived at 12 weeks...???

Nor have they at 20 weeks....?

24 weeks is viability, that seems like a sensible medical cutoff!!

CrikeyOHare Sat 06-Oct-12 13:21:05

He has to go - for having a different opinion to you??

MrsToddsShortcut Sat 06-Oct-12 13:21:16

Of course you are, and that's fine. but...

Let's say that a law is passed that prohibits abortion for anything other than medical reasons past 12 weeks. Do those of you that support this honestly believe that this will prevent abortions past 12 weeks?

Do you really believe that frightened and vulnerable girls and women who cannot cope with a pregnancy, some of them who will have no support, will manfully square their shoulders and decide to just soldier on?

If you believe that, then I'm afraid you are at best naive. Abortion will never go away, it will be driven back underground. The lives and health and well being of women and girls will be at risk through the re-emergence of underground and backstreet abortionists.

Nobody thinks abortion is a 'good' thing, but I believe it is a necessary thing for some women and girls. And it needs to be provided in a safe and regulated way. It is the duty of Government to make decisions that are in the best interests of it's electorate. And while it may well contradict your personal feelings, the 'best' thing for women and girls isn't to be driven back into the arms of unregulated and unsafe abortionists.

bellabreeze Sat 06-Oct-12 13:21:24

PeshwariNaan you obviously did not understand what I was trying to say. I was talking about the current cutoff point.

Anonymumous Sat 06-Oct-12 13:22:25

Blimey, what a lot of vitriol directed against someone just because he holds what I would have thought was a fairly uncontroversial viewpoint. It's not as if he wants to ban abortions altogether you know. hmm

I would LOVE to see the reaction on here if a politician suggested that a woman should have written permission from the father before she is allowed to abort his baby!!! grin grin grin

PeshwariNaan Sat 06-Oct-12 13:25:04

What MrsTodd said. Sensible.

YouMayLogOut Sat 06-Oct-12 13:26:26

Is Jeremy Hunt stepping forward to provide for all the unwanted children who would be born as a result of such a policy? No, thought not...

LonelyCloud Sat 06-Oct-12 13:26:33

Agree with MrsTodd about back-street abortionists returning.

jellybeans Sat 06-Oct-12 13:27:34

'Just to make clear that it is not just people who have had 'normal' pregnancies who think this. I, and sadly a few friends, have all had babies whose conditions were incompatible with life and all of us declined termination chose to continue to carry on the pregnancies until our babies died.'

But you chose to do that, it is a choice I am sure you were glad of. If you were forced to do the opposite you wouldn't have liked it. The vast majority of people with certain conditions do terminate (i think it is over 90% with Downs although of course this is people who have tested and know about it, some may refuse tests). In any case it is right that it is a choice. There are of course also cases where carrying on with the pregnancy could kill the mother. Eg in cases where there is massive amounts of fluid/hydrops in the baby; this can build up in the mother and cause a syndrome where it can kill the mother. In cases where the baby will die it is just a case of bringing the birth forward. Nature itself terminates many of these pregnancies.

SundaeGirl Sat 06-Oct-12 13:28:06

Before everyone decides that this is just more Tory twattishness...

There are many people on the centre-right who strongly believe in individual freedom as their central doctrine, as I do, and will be appalled by Jeremy Hunt. There's no way D Cameron will agree with him, either.

jellybeans Sat 06-Oct-12 13:29:52

I have never heard of a baby surviving at less than 22 weeks. I lost a baby myself through prem labour and was told they would do nothing till 23 weeks. Some countries it is 25 weeks before they will help. 24 weeks is the cut off where there is a real chance of survival but it is still tough and go. 20/21 weeks is impossible sadly.

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