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AIBU?

To think Julian Assange should grow a pair and just go to Sweden?

81 replies

AnonyMaw · 05/12/2011 17:28

I know for sure if I was accused of a crime I would want to have my opportunity to defend myself.

I think Assange should just stop weasling around, and go to Sweden now, to put his side of the story to court.

Or am I missing something?

OP posts:

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Prolesworth · 05/12/2011 17:29

Hear hear

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QuintessentialyFestive · 05/12/2011 17:29

Agreed.

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hiddenhome · 05/12/2011 17:30

Perhaps the court system is rigged and he's worried about being set up

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QuintessentialyFestive · 05/12/2011 17:31

He is going to sweden not Venus back in the dark ages.

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hiddenhome · 05/12/2011 17:32

Well, you never know.

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mayorquimby · 05/12/2011 17:37

fuck that. If I thought I was being wrongly accused or there was any chance , no matter how small, of me going to jail for something I didn't do I wouldn't go back to the country.
In the alternative if I'd done something as bad as what he's been accused of I'm most likely not going to be the type of person who'd face the music in a noble manner.

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QuintessentialyFestive · 05/12/2011 17:48

Well, I guess the fact that he wont go back means he is guilty!

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AwayinaKayzr · 05/12/2011 17:49

Yes he should go to Sweden. I think all this trying to avoid going is just making him look guilty.

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DeeOfTheNorth · 05/12/2011 17:50

As mayorquimby said....if you're thinking you're being set up or wrongly accused I can totally understand him fighting the extradition.

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suburbophobe · 05/12/2011 17:54

Ridiculous statement Quintessential....

Guilty of what exactly. Both those women he was staying in their flat and already having sexual relationships with them, if I'm not mistaken....

Well, personally I've heard (=read) it is all a set up and it will be possible to have him extradited to USA where they will give him the death penalty. That's what it's all about (AFAIK).

You only have to look at what happened to Bradley Manning (who has a British mother)....

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Prolesworth · 05/12/2011 18:20

"Both those women he was staying in their flat and already having sexual relationships with them, if I'm not mistaken...."

Ah well, obviously that means that they couldn't have been raped or sexually assaulted then eh? Cos obviously if you consent to sex with someone once then that consent stands for all time

The stuff about extradition to the US is bollocks. This is Sweden we're talking about, a country with an excellent reputation wrt human rights and freedom of speech. That's why Assange based himself there in the first place, although he's changed his tune now of course.

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suburbophobe · 05/12/2011 20:00

""Both those women he was staying in their flat and already having sexual relationships with them, if I'm not mistaken...."

Ah well, obviously that means that they couldn't have been raped or sexually assaulted then eh? Cos obviously if you consent to sex with someone once then that consent stands for all time hmm"

Well, really, who of us really know what went on?

Thing is, somebody blows a whistle and the whole world goes ape-shit....

That's why I don't believe anyone who has a clean record (US etc).

Well, yes, Sweden, great. Couldn't even find the murderer of Olaf Palme... I'd put all my trust in their justice system....

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suburbophobe · 05/12/2011 20:01

Like I wouldn't put my trust in USA justice system either.... enough evidence for that!

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TadlowDogIncident · 05/12/2011 20:12

I have to say, I completely don't get the argument that if he goes back to Sweden he'll be sent straight to the US. We have the feeblest extradition treaty in the whole wide world with the US - they basically just have to say they think someone's committed a crime, and we hand them over. They don't even have to make out a prima facie case. So why is he in more danger of being sent to the US if he goes to Sweden? Can anyone enlighten me?

I'm ignoring suburbophobe's line that you can't possibly be raped by someone you were previously having a consensual sexual relationship with. I've had a bad enough day already.

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Kladdkaka · 05/12/2011 20:19

You are aware aren't you that both women were happily socialising with him after the alleged assaults and only claimed they had been violated after they found out he had been sleeping with other?

You are also aware aren't you that the prosecutor (at the other end of the country to where the alleged crimes took place) who took up the cause when the other prosecutor (in the place where they allegedly took place) said there was no case to answer is part of a group who wish to amend Sweden's already broad definition of rape to include consensual sex where the woman later finds out info that had she known she wouldn't have consented?

Are are also aware that the case will be heard behind closed doors?

And that there will be no jury?

And that the case will be decided not by an independent judge and jury but by a panel made up of representatives of main political parties?

I live in Sweden. There is a lot I love about Sweden. The legal system isn't one of them. It scares the shit out of me.

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AlwaysWild · 05/12/2011 20:23

Kladdkaka - You are aware aren't you that rape is not something that just happens to nuns in dark alleys aren't you?

OP - YANBU.

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Kladdkaka · 05/12/2011 20:24

TadlowDogIncident Sweden co-operated with secret US rendition. The UK refused.

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Kladdkaka · 05/12/2011 20:24

No I wasn't. Thanks for enlightening me.

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ElderberrySyrup · 05/12/2011 20:27

Kladdkaka, do you know about trauma bonding, the fact that some women take a while to recognise their rapes as rape, and the many other reasons why women may well socialise with their rapist after the assault?
Victims don't always rush straight to the police station.

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Kladdkaka · 05/12/2011 20:39

Yes I do. That's not the point. The point is that there is hard evidence, that the prosecutor refused to supply for the UK courts, that this particular woman advocates using the law in any way possible to punish unfaithful men. Plus her own statement to the police says that the sex was consensual. The UK court was told that she was asleep. This is what the prosecutor claims. The woman herself said she was sleepy. A very slight change in the language which makes a huge difference.

Do I think he's guilty? Haven't got a clue.
Do I think he's a nice man? No, I think he's an odius creep.
Do I trust the Swedish system to give him a fair hearing? Not in a month of Sunday's.

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AlwaysWild · 05/12/2011 20:42

So why did you post this then?

"You are aware aren't you that both women were happily socialising with him after the alleged assaults and only claimed they had been violated after they found out he had been sleeping with other?"

If your only concern is the legal process, why on earth would you post that?

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MollieO · 05/12/2011 20:43

I'm not a fan of his but from what I read it does seem he has some genuine concern that he is being set up.

I also wonder if there is a risk if he does go to Sweden of him being extradited to the US?

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CurlyBoy · 05/12/2011 20:44

Sorry, but you are missing something.

The US has charged him due to all of those secret military documents he released on his site. Sweden has a much more open extradition with the US than the UK does. His fear is that if he goes to Sweden they'll hand him over to the US and he'll wind up in some dark hole in Guantanamo and never see the light of day again. Frankly, I don't blame him one bit.

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FreudianSlipper · 05/12/2011 20:53

first if all he thinks he has been wrongly accused

secondly and which is the bigger factor he is a man that many governments (especially the us) want to silence (and i would rather they didn't)

it is not as simple as proving his innocence or his guilt

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dancingmustard · 05/12/2011 20:54

Why should Assange go back to a country where he isn't going to be given a fair and open trial?