in thinking they should pay DS something.

[theredhen]

My DS aged 13 has a real interest in computers.

I asked an acquaintance who owns the local computer shop, if he had any jobs for my son as he was so keen to learn about the workings of computers. I didn't expect him to say yes as DS is quite young and a little bit shy too. However, much to DS delight he said yes. He works for around 1.5 hours after school one night a week.

Now DS is getting experience of computers and life experience and I know that is a valuable commodity especially at such a young age. I also realise that they are probably "finding him things to do" and he isn't exactly self sufficient in managing his own work load. lol. I also realise that it's not much time per week and chances are he wouldn't be doing anything else much with that time.

He has been doing this for nearly three months and no sign of any payment at all.

Am I being unreasonable to think they should offer him something, even just a fiver a month?

[mumeeee]

If they pay him. They have to get a work permit for him as he is under 16 and that will cost them money. They are just doing him a favour and giving him experience

[AKMD]

YABU really because if they took him on as an employee I think they'd be breaking the law. It sounds like your acquaintance is doing you and your son a big favour.

[LordOfTheFlies]

Couldn't he get a few bits for his computer?
Printer cartridges and the like?

Trouble is, if they see it as them doing your son a favour, then they won't see why they should pay him.
And he would have to be supervised in what he's doing, so that takes the owners time.

I'd just look at it as being a recipricol arangement. Your son will let you know when it's run it's course.

[amistillsexy]

This sounds like a misunderstanding. Are you sure you asked for 'a job' and not 'work experience'?

As others have said, he is too young for 'a job', without paperwork, and what he is being given is 'work experience', which might help him get a job later on.

IMO, the important thing is-does he enjoy it? If he is happy, then be happy for him.

If you are proud of him,and think he has shown good qualities for work, such as commitment, punctuality, a willingness to learn, etc, then why don't you reward him for that, in lieu of a wage, just so he knows you value what he's doing.

[LaDolcheRyvita]

YABU. Definitely.

You approached this man. He has obliged. Your ds is gaining socially (he's a bit shy) is getting "work experience", its his own special interest and he can put it on his CV.

You'd be out of order to expect payment, at this stage. Maybe if he were doing more hours in the future or it became a Saturday job.

[gardenpixies32]

15 & 16 year olds do 2 full weeks work experience for no pay.

While training as a teacher, I worked 24 weeks in schools, full time, with no pay.

Many apprentices in big cities work in cut throat industries to gain experience, for no pay.

YABU.

They are giving him valuable experience, worth more than a fiver, IMO.

[AKMD]

If you are proud of him,and think he has shown good qualities for work, such as commitment, punctuality, a willingness to learn, etc, then why don't you reward him for that, in lieu of a wage, just so he knows you value what he's doing.

That's a good idea.

[LaurieFairyCake]

you could pay him or reward him in some way for his extra work. Lots of praise too.

The shopkeeper can't as he would be breaking the law - it's really that simple.

[Firefly2]

Legally he could be paid for this, as it would be counted as 'light work' but like the other comments have suggested I think you should look at it as a favour to your son. He will definatly be getting valuable work exp and I agree - maybe you should bung him a little pocket money to encourage him. I definatley don't think you should say anything because the shop keeper probably thinks he is doing you a favour as he is teaching your son about computers. I am sure you are very proud of your son and that is the main thing here! Good for him! :)

[rockinhippy]

YABU - by the sounds of the extra work involved in managing your Son & finding him things to to, they are doing you & your Son a big favour - be grateful for that

[Anniegetyourgun]

Just pray they don't send you a bill for childcare.

[DeWe]

From: www.direct.gov.uk/

Employers must inform the education department of their local authority that they have employed a school-aged child. If satisfied with the arrangements, the council will issue the child with an employment permit, if this is required by local byelaws. A child is not insured without one.

Children do not need a work permit for work experience that his/her school arranges.

Local byelaws list the jobs that 13 year olds can do. No 13 year old can work in a job that doesn't appear on the list. Local byelaws may place further restrictions on the hours and conditions of work and the nature of employment. For help and advice or to apply for a work permit contact the education department of your local council or education welfare service

HTH.

[omgomgomg]

Yes, you are being unreasonable.

He is lucky to be getting help with his hobby.

Think of it this way, they could pay him for what he accomplishes in that hour and a half and then bill him for his training/their time in guiding him along etc. You might end up out of pocket.

[DamnBamboo]

Yes YABVVU.

You have no idea if he is a hindrance or a help and how much effort they have to make with him.

He is getting valuable work experience and something to put on a CV - that is payment enough.

[theredhen]

Ok, thanks for the replies.

I think I'm going to pay him a few quid myself. He has started to lose heart a bit after the intial enthusiasm. He is doing fairly mundane stuff but not as bad as sweeping the floor. They have told him that he is better than the work experience boy (aged 16) they currently have.

I do appreciate the time he is being given and the training, something to put on his CV etc and that is certainly my main reason for encouraging him.

Obviously some of his friends have paper rounds etc, and they are all amazed he doesn't get paid. Some of my friends have tried to say he is being "used" as free labour etc. hence why I asked the question.

[HecateGoddessOfTheNight]

Yes, I think they think they are doing him a favour. You approached them. They didn't advertise a job. They are trying to help him. It is unreasonable of you to expect them to pay him to allow them to help him. erm. iyswim.

If they are using him, making demands of him, expecting him to come in and treating him like an employee, then you could probably argue they should pay him. But if they are actually just finding stuff for him to do, to help him out, and if he doesn't go in one week they don't really care... then it would be cheeky to expect payment too.

And, tbh - I've helped out youngsters. It doesn't reduce your workload - it increases it. A lot.

You do it to help them, I promise you that it doesn't make things easier for you

[slavetofilofax]

YABVU.

They are only 'using' him because you asked them too!

[DoMeDon]

I see where you are coming from OP - especially in light of comments from friends with paper rounds. Personally I would give him something for his time if he was working for me regularly, doing something useful and making a good job of it (and better than the 16 yo!) Maybe they can't legally but am surprised he doesn't get a back hander.

[rockinhippy]

DoMeDon I'm not surprised "he doesn't get a back hander" I echo Hectates comments - having had work experience kids myself in the past too, doesn't matter how bright they are, it really DOESN"T help & make things easier,

the time it takes to "find things for him to do" you could have done it yourself or had a staff member do it & its a headache & a half - you do it for the kids, not yourself, I've had some who where a first class PITA, no common sense at all - try dealing with that as a favour on top of running a business - if he were sweeping the floor & nothing else, then maybe the OPs friends might have a point, but it sounds very much like its for the OPs Sons benefit, even if the work is mundane its NOT for the business - sadly the boys friends with paper rounds are winding him up, so he's getting disheartened, which is a real shame

hopefully a bit of pin money from you will will help him feel better thheredhen

[fickencharmer]

It would be genrous to give him some reward.

But work experience is common now and it is easier for better off parents to subsidise their children.

High unemployment, especailly among the young, mean it is an employers market. In a broadsheet it was suggesting that the tax people were challenging its legality.

And the govt said "we are suggesting minimum wage must be paid where applicable"

That was not want Davie C said some months ago. So perhaps the legal position is going to be changed for over 16s