to not let her go to the zoo

[Theycallmethingy]

this may be long, so sorry,

DD, 9 has been a pain for a while now, attitude, answering back, generally stroppy. We moved countries 8mths ago (UK to USA) but she settled in beautifully to start with, made friends, joined stuff, told us she was really happy. Up until now she has always been well behaved and made us really proud of her.

We have friends visiting from UK (a one-off) and I had told her she and other DD6 could have the day off school tom to go to the zoo with them (is a half day where they mostly do drama and sport, will learn more at zoo)

This morning got email from teacher to say she has not been paying attention/working at all in class, not been handing in homework (she hasn't been telling me about homework, although we do some every night) and that her teacher is Very Concerned (asked to see teacher tonight, she had a meeting, she suggested tomorrow...)

So do I let her take tomorrow off school as promised.

Tried to make this short as poss, so pls ask if you need clarification. Any comments would help I think.

Thanks

[squeakytoy]

Could your guests possibly reschedule the zoo visit to another day perhaps?

I do think it is important that you see the teacher as soon as you can, and if your daughter takes tomorrow off, it might raise questions as to if it is related to the fact she has been caught out by the teacher.

[SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnets]

Let her have the day off...she's 9 and may be starting hormonal changes and he has moved countries. When I went through a similarly hard time as a kid...I got in a massive lot of trouble at school and my Mum spoiled me rotten as she realised I was sad and worried...not simply naughty.

I think a nice day and some pats on the back are fine....discuss what she feels lke in class too....why shes not concentrating. Is she worried about peer group friendships? Feeling she needs to concentrate a lot on them?

[FriedEggyAndSlippery]

I think you have to let her. Because of the massive life change, and also because you presumably hadn't warned her 'you can only have this treat if you work hard' it's really unfair to take that away.

Let her do this, and explain that afterwards she must start working harder or there will be consequences (what they should be, I've no idea, but they should be pre arranged)

[BugsnBites]

Sounds like the teacher is referring to a problem that's been ongoing for sometime. Explain to the teacher why you're not going to be in (friends visiting, zoo visit) and schedule a meeting soon as possible. It's a poor situation, but not an emergency situation. And you don't want to go off on one at DD without knowing all the facts.

So don't mix up the zoo visit with whatever is going on at school.

[lurkerspeaks]

I'm going to buck the trend.

She isn't paying attention in school and therefore she misses the treat.....

[ignatz]

It's unfortunate timing but the two things are unconnected and personally I wouldn't have thought it was fair to withdraw a previously arranged privelege until I had followed up fully on what might need some consequences.

[Theycallmethingy]

Gosh, you all make lots of sense, thanks.

I will email teacher now, and let her know, and find a date to suit asap.

Friends can't reschedule as they are only here a short time, and if shes going to have time off I would rather it was this day.

SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnet - your mum sounds lovely and kind as do you themildmanneredjanitor

Thank you ALL so much.

[lurkerspeaks]

Sorry. I don't think you are sending a very good message to your daughter.

You have been contacted by the school indicating a potentially serious problem "Very concerned" in my book = serious problem.

You then continue to remove the child concerned from a day at school to go and have fun with friends and in doing so you miss the opportunity to meet with her teacher........

[squeakytoy]

Afraid I am with Lurker. Bad behaviour should be dealt with and have consequences, it will probably hit her harder to miss out on a fun trip, but it wont do any harm. You can always take her to the zoo once she has shown signs of her behaviour improving.

[Theycallmethingy]

oh heck. Now I just dont know.

[doley]

Don't cancel ...it is unrelated IMO :)

Changing countries is a massive adjustment ~she could still be adapting .

I have moved from the UK ~US , well 6 years ago ...it is early days for her .

We are retuning to the UK soon ,my eldest has been behaving as your daughter is ...I think it is something to do with settling down/changing schools .

PLUS, IMO. they take everything more seriously in the schools here (good most of the time right ?) it might not be that bad ( my experience talking)

[Hedgerow7]

I also think it is very unfair to withdraw a treat without warning. You didn't say, buck up at school or else you won't go to the zoo. the punishment would seem very unfair to me.

a trip to the zoo would do her the world of good and could impact on her behaviour at school in a positive way. Please take her :)

[southofthethames]

I think it would send a message that Mum was being very erratic and unreliable if you were to forbid her going to the zoo with friends as a punishment for something over a long period that she can't rectify now. If you'd told her a month or more ago that the treat was conditional on her doing very well at school, then you could stop her going, but it's too late for that now as you haven't given her any advance warning. Besides, they are going with your UK friends, and grounding her puts a sour note on it for your friends too, and they have come a long way to visit.

I think it would be illogical to use the zoo as a punishment (and I'm normally a tough parent on discipline issues!). Certainly she should get a "detention" of some sort for her behaviour - am more concerned about the stroppy bit and not handing in homework, than the not paying attention bit. It sounds like she is unhappy - whether due to adjustment issues, feeling not confident and overwhelmed at school, or bullying/not getting on well with classmates/feeling excluded by other kids, some cause of unhappiness.

I don't think being off school one day will make a difference to her performance as long as you get a chance to talk to her teacher. Perhaps also removing her from school for one day will give her a bit of space to think about her different things are when she is not in school. And I doubt very much putting her back in school just for one day will magically turn her school performance to A+ standards.

Am more concerned that she doesn't just get a knee jerk punishment but to find out if there is an underlying cause. Perhaps a more helpful and relevant "penalty" might be for her to stay home for several weekends in a row to sit down and go through her school work, do more practice sums/essays/exercises (whichever topic it is that she isn't doing well in). Not only does it address the issue of her below par performance, it will give her some quiet time to tackle her work. I don't really think excluding her from the outing will work and may make her miserable and her academic performance worse.

(I do remember something similar in my early teens when I just felt very overwhelmed with a new class, new classmates, more school work.....and started not paying attention and not handing in work on time or at all - if a teacher had spoken to my parents that might have helped more but as I'd been a "good" student before I think they thought they would let me off. It took me a bit longer to deal with it and snap out of it as a result - but it did resolve in the end as I learnt how to handle change. Just thinking your daughter's situation had some similarities)

I know you've already come up with a solution, just thought I'd share a bit of personal experience if that helps.

[VajazzHands]

I've moved countries several times as an adult and can confirm its pretty fucking difficult. Not fair to punish her on this occasion as she can hardly adjust her behaviour and learn for next time since the friends visitng is a one-off treat. Let her have this and take something away after they leave.

I wonder if the mums hardlining on here have ever moved country?

[southofthethames]

I don't usually disagree with people point blank on MN, but just in response to lurkerspeaks and squeakytoy - what they suggest is perfectly appropriate if it were normal circumstances and the family were still in the UK, but this child of nine has migrated to a foreign country and been uprooted from everything she knows to be familiar - I think until one has gone through the experience, people do not understand how unsettling it is to move to a foreign country. Punishing her by excluding her from this trip could send the message that not only does her mum not care about what she is going through, but her mum is punishing her for a decision (to move from the UK) that she herself did not make.

Culture shock can take a while to set in, and she could well have said she was happy in order to please her mum, or perhaps she enjoyed it at first but now the real adjustment difficulties are starting. There can be a honeymoon period at first but after some time, daily fries can start to pall and you really miss cottage pie. Not the pie per se, just the fact that you now can't get it when you want. Or CBBC. Or being able to see your favourite football team on Match of the Day. Just to give examples.

It can be even more unsettling if they speak the same language and look the same - ie if you migrate to Japan or India people may treat you more sympathetically and supportively because you look different as well as sound different. There is a massive cultural difference between the US and the UK (I lived there for 2 months) which you aren't aware of as a tourist. And children don't have any concept of what to expect or how to deal with it, because their life experience is limited. (Yes, I was a migrant too.)

[VajazzHands]

Very well put southofthethames

[southofthethames]

Thanks, VajazzHands.

[GapsAGoodUn]

I agree with southofthethames.

Having just moved countries with my children I can see how much it has affected them. We are in Australia and again speaking the same language, so much shared culture you'd think it would be easy and they are coping magnificently on the surface.

Underneath I can detect massive amounts of homesickness.

I'm sure that your daughter isn't being deliberately awful at school. I'd say that the reality that 'this is the future' has just kicked in, and knowing girls of that age there probably is some major bitchiness going on.

If it were me, I'd go softly softly. Give her a hug and ask her if she's been struggling at school. After all you catch more flies with honey.

[Ormirian]

Did you warn her that bad behaviour at school would have these consequences? If not don't cancel.

She needs to be listened to and supported, not punished. I can only guess at the upheaval she feels.

[Theycallmethingy]

you lot are brilliant, and I so appreciate your help.

Having had a chat it has become clear that her peer group is pretty difficul;t, and she is overwhelmed.

She is havin gthe day at the zoo tomorrow, and then I will meet with her teacher and straighten things out.

Thanks so much

xx

[GapsAGoodUn]

Glad we might have helped.

She's lucky to have a lovely mum like you.

[bubblecoral]

You are doing the right thing imo.

When you know all the facts and you have the teachers input on the things she needs to work on, you can agree with her what she is going to do and the clear consequenses if she doesn't. Whilst at the same time being supportive and listening to her fears.

I think punishment without warning would just make her angry and less likely to open up to you about anything she is worried about.

[FirmBottom]

im not sure what i would do i suposse i woud still let her go but talk to the teacher and give your DD9 a warning

[southofthethames]

Oh goody! Very pleased she can enjoy your friends' company, may feel like a bit of home for her. I agree with GapsAGoodUn, she's lucky to have a lovely mum.