AIBU to be upset with my Landlady.....

(108 Posts)
MsToni Wed 30-Mar-11 20:50:54

.....for saying we can't have a puppy?

My little man and I fell in love with a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel and we have everything ready for him.

I made the mistake of telling my L'lady about it last night (we are renting) and she was very dissuasive saying it was hard work, he'd need constant care and attention bla bla bla.

10 minutes later, she sends a text saying she and her husband discussed it and "its not a good idea, by the time its trained, it could damage the wooden floors, they open their bowels on the floor, its impossible to get the smell and stain out, they are unhappy with the idea of a dog in the house...."

I understand the demands of having a puppy, and I was prepared to accept the early settling issues, have a trainer in, get a comfy "doggy space" in the (huge) kitchen, ensure he's fully trained before settling him in his "area" in the lounge, dog sitter/walker when I'm at work etc.

My partner says I've OCD because I'm excessively clean and like everything spanking neat and clean so I'd be the last person to allow a puppy ruin the house.

Now, I'm so upset. I just want to go ahead and get him and tell her it was too late to change the plan. We have a good relationship and I don't want to ruin it but I'm just so upset with her now, I can't / don't even want to speak with her (yet).

I'm really not happy with her.

(Sorry for venting) blush

Is it in your Tenancy Agreement that you can (or can't) have a dog? On a very basic level I do think it's a bit off that people who rent can't have animals when, frequently, the people who rent to them do. Seems unfair.

takewhatyoucan Wed 30-Mar-11 20:54:35

oh that is a shame! However, from what I remember when I was renting, no pets was written in to the contract. No pets in rental seems common place to me..

squeakytoy Wed 30-Mar-11 20:55:30

Its not just the mess, its the damage a pup can do too.

Maybe get a rescue dog that is house trained and doesnt chew? She might be more negotiable on that.

YANBU for being upset, but YABU for being upset with your LL. Puppies piss everywhere, and she's right I'm afraid.

Puppies also chew.. a LOT. Our kitchen was destroyed by a small cocker spaniel. We had to put up guards to stop him chewing the door frames.

LoopyLoopsChupaChups Wed 30-Mar-11 20:58:34

YABU.

Why one earth did you get all the stuff and get your son excited before checking with your landlady?

We have a house that we rent out, because we moved and couldn't sell it. Exactly this happened. She (mother of toddler) wanted a dog, we said no. She got one anyway. Rather than upset things, and as she appeared to be very neat and tidy, we allowed her to keep the dog.

The house is now ruined. The beautiful garden is a mud pit with no plants (I loved that garden), original doors are chewed up and neighbours are thoroughly pissed off, as the poor creature was kept outside (no kennel or anything) most of the time and howled.

We will definitely stick to the "no pets" rule in the future. I don't want to go back to my lovely house as her stupid decision has ruined it.

I'm not saying that you will be the same, but it isn't your house, so you need to abide by what the owners say. If you can't do that, find a different property.

scottishmummy Wed 30-Mar-11 21:01:13

yabu,thats your LL investment and not everyone wants to rent a property a pissy puppy casting hair everywhere leaving dog smells.i have lived in rentals that were no smokers no pets and i wouldnt rent where pets or smokers had been

if you defy her she could give you notice to quit.dont lose your home over some sentimental notion about a dog

and stop being such a drama queen dont want to speak to her,you have a business relationship.thats all.shes not there to pander to your puppy demands

Mandy2003 Wed 30-Mar-11 21:02:14

I have bought my flat leasehold and the lease says "No Pets" so it's not that uncommon. Why not give yourselves something to look forward to when you no longer rent or have moved to another property. I see that you do not mention having a garden to let the dog go out. An essential I would think?

Vallhala Wed 30-Mar-11 21:02:14

"I made the mistake of telling my L'lady about it"

And THAT is where you became unreasonable. Had you/were you to bring a pup into the LLs house without her permission and she found out, what would you do?

Leave the house, search for another, possibly move the DC into a new school/nursery, increase the distance to work, pay a higher rent, the cost of removals, carpets, curtains and the like in order to keep your pup?

Or get rid of him in order to keep your house?

Because I can tell you what the vast majority would do in that position and it isn't put the puppy first.

If you're on good terms with the LL try to negotiate taking on an older rescue dog or FOSTERING a rescue dog - the rescue pays for food and any vet treatment ever needed, you get all the fun and no obligation - which, if you go via a reputable rescue and the dog is matched to your needs, will ensure as much as anyone can that the problems which *inevitably( come with even the best behaved of puppies are not an issue in your landlady's house.

haggis01 Wed 30-Mar-11 21:03:04

Maybe you could talk to her again - explain how clean you will keep the place, replace/repair any damage etc. She may not want to lose a reliable tenant. It is often written into a contract that there can be no pets - could check on your agreement but I think I read recently of someone taking their case to court about no pets clauses and winning as there is a right to have pets.

A flat I used to live in was leasehold and in the lease it said there could be no pets at all and no children making noise after 9pm!!! although adults in the other flats certainly made a lot.

rockinhippy Wed 30-Mar-11 21:04:26

Sorry, but after seeing the state of a flat, that friends of ours rented on a short let, to be near Parents for a while - your landlady is right - their ADULT dog, trashed the wooden floor, all carpets, curtains, bed & sofa(shes a chewer & clawer) - & our friends thought losing the deposit would cover ithmm

Another friends dog, regularly strips her wallpaper, up to above waist hight & chewed door frames

I bought a house once where the corner of the hall wall had been chewed back to & THROUGH the brick, not a small chuck but right up to almost the full length of the wallshock & all the door frames needed replacing too[shock[

& Puppies are often worse

I wouldn't let a flat to dog owners

I love dogs, but get yourself a Kitten - much less hassel

Mandy2003 Wed 30-Mar-11 21:05:02

Oh, plus I am not allowed to permit fencing or athletics inside the flat!

CoffeeDodger Wed 30-Mar-11 21:06:21

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LoopyLoopsChupaChups Wed 30-Mar-11 21:08:28

Sorry, but a tenant who would even consider not asking permission for such a big thing cannot be a "reliable tenant".

A dog owner who has a clandestine dog, waiting to jeopardise the future stability of the family home, is neither a responsible dog owner nor a responsible parent.

This has actually made me really cross.

Vallhala Wed 30-Mar-11 21:08:55

Can I point out that we are not ALL bad tenants! I rent a lovely, well kept house in the country and I have three large breed dogs.

My Landlord has just renewed my tenancy.

scottishmummy Wed 30-Mar-11 21:09:04

stop being so demanding and sentimental.a pup not worth breaching tenancy over or causing ill feeling. at moment in rental market more tenants than rentals,do you really want jeopardise that for a pissy pooch

and you are affecting her ability to market flat to other tenants if you get a dog.as i said other dont like flats dogs or smokers have been in,they stink and need deep clean

buy maramaduke and cats & dogs dvd and be done with it

LoopyLoopsChupaChups Wed 30-Mar-11 21:14:20

Of course not Val, you are responsible. I assume you asked permission for your dogs, and that you never considered going against your landlord/lady's consent if they said no. You are an experienced dog handler, and are able to train to avoid damage to property.
Sadly, as you know, many people like the idea of a puppy but have no idea what it really entails, often ending up in the dog being rehomed (or worse).

LessNarkyPuffin Wed 30-Mar-11 21:15:17

biscuit

Pancakeflipper Wed 30-Mar-11 21:17:04

You know you should have asked your landlady first for your sake and hers.

If you go ahead after she has said no and get the dog - the trust she has with you will be zilch. If it is a decent property in a good area and easy to rent out then you could be out at the end of your contract or even given notice.

You could try to speak to her and her husband face to face and see if there is any room to negioate like higher rent and her making regular checks on the house and you paying for repairs. But please don't get the dog on the quiet.

FabbyChic Wed 30-Mar-11 21:17:57

Unfortunately it is not uncommon in rented properties to not be allowed dogs.

Although I am in a rented with a Westie, I go through an Agency though who are pretty relaxed.

There really isn't much you can do but resign yourself to the fact that you cannot have a dog.

Sorry.

LoveLeonardCohen Wed 30-Mar-11 21:19:19

YABU.....did you check the tenancy agreement before you decided you wanted to get this puppy? did you ask LL first? Puppies can cause a lot of damage, I have been a LL and would not have allowed pets

Vallhala Wed 30-Mar-11 21:19:57

Loopy my criteria for a house was:

1. One which accepts dogs

2. See 1

4. See 1



There is NO WAY I'd have taken the house without permission for my dogs and NO WAY I'd have moved without taking them with me... I'd live in a cardboard box first!

I movved with 2 adult dogs and asked the LL if I could have the third, a long-term (read permanent ) foster dog six months later. To my delight my LL was fine with the third dog but had he said no then I wouldn't have taken him on... and the rescue wouldn't have let me foster him anyway.

livinginthesticks Wed 30-Mar-11 21:20:07

well I am a landlady and have just spent nearly £2,000 repairing the damage the last tenants did to my flat - not trashing it just things like having to repaint the walls, new carpets from cigarette burns, broken radiator etc (all had been redecorated less than a year ago).

There's no way I would be happy to have a puppy in the flat and I can't believe you weren't going to tell her.

YANBU, it sounds like you have a good relationship with landlady though? What if you offered to pay an additional deposit against any possible damage, a new contract with a clause about responsibility for any repairs, might that make her reconsider?

I sort of don't blame her but if you are otherwise good tenants then it would be a shame if she didn't reconsider.

GilmoreGeek Wed 30-Mar-11 21:24:02

Haha, I love that clause MANDY! I wonder what counts as athletics, your average Jillian Michaels video? Or only professional sports? Which makes me question how big your flat is... wink

BUt I agree with everyone else, a puppy is not a really good idea. You can't predict how he is going to behave and I wouldn't want one in my house. I know loads of people love dogs but I don't enough to be willing to let some of my house be ruined.

Vallhala Wed 30-Mar-11 21:24:26

This reminds me just how hard it is for those with dogs to rent. As you can imagine, renting with 3 large dogs requires a minor miracle and yet why? Because some people screw us all up by having dogs they aren't allowed or by allowing them to damage the property.

Well thanks a bunch to all those people because you give the rest of us a bad name and cause us incredible problems when seeking to rent.

Vallhala Wed 30-Mar-11 21:25:54

Oh Jesus, my grammar is really up the swanny tonight! I do NOT have dogs to rent!

HappyMummyOfOne Wed 30-Mar-11 21:28:48

YABVU, its her house and she can set the rules. If you had a good relationship with her you would have asked before viewing any animals in the first place.

forehead Wed 30-Mar-11 21:29:17

YABVVVVVVVVU

MsToni Wed 30-Mar-11 21:29:42

There is no "No Pets" Clause in the Tenancy, there's a huge garden at the back of the house and I considered having the "dog house" in the garden (though it would break my heart to leave him outside).

I suppose "its her house, its her rules" overrides everything. We've made major improvements to the house, improved its value and gone beyond what's expected in making the house to our requirement / taste - without expecting any refund / payment from her - she didn't object. I wouldn't even dream of destroying the house.

She has 1 puppy and 1 dog and frankly I didn't expect it to be an issue.

I suppose I'll just have to chin up and wait till we get our house.....

He really is adorable though and its heartbreaking giving him up......

Vallhala Wed 30-Mar-11 21:31:59

Didn't the breeder ask you if you had permission from your LL first of all? Any decent one would - and any breeder who doesn't ask such questions is only after a fast buck and should be avoided in the first place.

scottishmummy Wed 30-Mar-11 21:32:53

she has 2 dogs in her own home you rent her property.completely different. your rental is her long term asset,to be managed accordingly

AKMD Wed 30-Mar-11 21:34:25

YABVU and sound like a child having a strop. "It's not faaaaaaaiiir!" I bet your DS isn't making nearly as much fuss as you are. I can't believe that you got him so excited over a pet that you knew you weren't allowed to have and that you contemplated not telling your LL about your stupid plans. It is people like you who ruin things for responsible tenants by making LLs think they are taking a huge risk every time they rent their property out. angry

bubblecoral Wed 30-Mar-11 21:34:52

YABVU. You should have checked before you made plans, I can't believe anyone wouldn't tbh!

MsToni Wed 30-Mar-11 21:49:50

@ AKMD

@ 2500 pcm, I would want to be happy in "my" home and do what makes me happy...including having the "audacity" to make "stupid plans" like having a dog especially since it was NOT expressly forbidden.

But you are right. I'm being stroppy.....venting, like I pointed out.

xxxx

JaneS Wed 30-Mar-11 21:58:49

TBA, I think if there is no 'No Pets' clause you weren't be unreasonable at all to feel upset. No Pets clauses are very standard and your landlady ought to recognize that one of the reasons you rented with her might have been that clause.

I can see her side as I think dogs probably are a bit of a liability for landlords, but I would feel upset she didn't see fit to put it in the tenancy agreement.

BluddyMoFo Wed 30-Mar-11 22:04:41

Move then.

mamatomany Wed 30-Mar-11 22:06:32

Our puppy trashed the wooden floors so YABU I'm afraid, wait until they are your floors to decide who gets to pee on them.

Clytaemnestra Wed 30-Mar-11 22:10:20

"especially since it was NOT expressly forbidden."

You mean, apart from the no pets clause in the contract you signed?

MsToni Wed 30-Mar-11 22:14:21

There was NO "No Pets Clause" in Agreement.

JaneS Wed 30-Mar-11 22:22:13

Actually, just thinking about it - obviously it'd be a terrible idea to get the dog now as your LL would be furious, but I'm not sure she can legally stop you given the lack of the clause.

A friend of mine deliberately found someone with no 'no pets' clause because she has guinea-pigs (much less messy, admittedly!), and I know in that situation the LL wasn't allowed to make her move out until her statutory 6 months were up - he was hopping mad about it, though.

£2500 a month? Where do you live?

PinkToeNails Thu 31-Mar-11 10:59:03

Your landlady is right. Dogs wee everywhere and they smell. In the standard contract no pets are allowed. It is her house so you should respect her wishes. There is no way I would let someone with a dog live in my house.

Abr1de Thu 31-Mar-11 11:04:33

I am a dog lover but I'm with your LL on this one. The last two caused damage amounting to £2000 pounds: chewed carpets, ruined carpets, chewed furniture. Get an older dog.

mrsSOAK Thu 31-Mar-11 11:06:29

sorry but YABVVU.
When we moved into our rented home we had to pay an additional 'pet deposit' for our 2 cats.
Trying to find a home for rent with pets is a nightmare but there are some out there. Just like Val, if the landlady had said no to the cats we wouldn't have even considered moving in.

YABU - I am a LL and there is no way I would let a tenant have a puppy. I have just spent about £15 refurbing and it looks lovely......I want to keep it that way.

One of the few rights a LL has! If my tenant got a puppy without asking me and I found out......night night!

CinnabarRed Thu 31-Mar-11 11:15:11

I lived in rented when I split from XH. I had three cats, and refused to view any properties with no pets clauses. It did limit me quite a lot. When I found somewhere, I had to pay double the usual deposit and guarantee to get all the carpets professionally cleaned when I moved out.

Would your LL consider a cat instead?

poutintrout Thu 31-Mar-11 11:21:12

I can understand that it is a landlords perogative to decide not to rent their house to tenants with a dog. OP I think that you should have asked your LL before making arrangements to get the dog. However I am an owner of two well behaved dogs currently looking for a new rental house and I may as well be trying to find unicorn poo.
The instant assumption seems to be that a house will be wrecked & will be one giant dog bed/toilet. This is not true and rather insulting & frustrating when you view some houses that have had "dogless" tenants in who have obviously not looked after the property & don't know one end of a hoover from another. Since owning my dogs I have never cleaned so much in my life because I have standards and just because I choose to live with animals don't want to live like one.

I get especially annoyed when a property says it will accept cats but not dogs. Now I love cats but they are, if that way inclined, likely to cause more damage than dogs in the way of scratching and urine smells.

Pinktoenails A dog will not, if properly trained, wee or mess indoors and with regular grooming and bathing combined with a good house cleaning regime will not make a house smell.

Sweetpea215 Thu 31-Mar-11 11:28:42

I definately would not go against your landlady....

Apart from risking being given a 'notice to quit' you also risk not being able to rent anywhere else once you leave..as you will (very likely) need to have a good reference from your landlady.

I don't actually believe this is a real post.
I am a landlady and our current tenants have a couple of cats. The ones before got a Yorkshire terrier and it chewed all the kitchen cabinets. Luckily it was only the door so they weren't too expensive to replace.
We were very angry as the tenant had asked and we said no.

Ariesgirl Thu 31-Mar-11 11:36:11

Pretty much every rented house advert you see in the paper says "no pets". It's sucks but there's nothing you can do unless you want to break the terms of the tenancy agreement and risk eviction. We have a small, quiet, well behaved cat and have been stuck in the same cold damp house for years because we can't find another one which allows pets

dignified Thu 31-Mar-11 11:36:24

If you work full time and have a pup your going to come back to a serious mess . They need to be constantly supervised and let out hourly , i found my pup more hard work than a baby . If your adamant you could offer a large deposit in case it does do any damage , but if your not there a lot , it absoluteley will.

Shes right about weeing on floorboards though.

PinkToeNails Thu 31-Mar-11 11:37:53

Point accepted pout. I was being very small minded and basing my views on just few dogs - I hate it when others do the same so I do apologise.

I shouldn't label all dogs/owners as being the same.

harassedinherpants Thu 31-Mar-11 11:44:28

"Well thanks a bunch to all those people because you give the rest of us a bad name and cause us incredible problems when seeking to rent."

I'd like to agree with Valhalla on this!!

We sold our house to rent about 3yrs ago and wouldn't view a house that wouldn't take my beloved 10yr old cocker. We paid an extra £500 deposit though. Unfortunately he got very ill and had to be pts 6 months later. I have to say though that as a puppy no one would have wanted him lol!! He was a chewer then and wrecked my dining room table, doors and kitchen units...... As a 10yr old though he was no bother.

We haven't got another dog (although would love to) as we're still renting and don't feel we could at the moment, so we have a 16 week old kitten now. Much less bother than a puppy!!

BreconBeBuggered Thu 31-Mar-11 11:44:48

When I was looking for somewhere to rent a few years ago, most of the landlords of the houses I liked the look of stipulated No Children, never mind No Pets (and they hadn't even met mine ). I don't think YABU if there was no express No Pets clause in your rental contract. But leaving a puppy in the house alone when you're at work is probably asking for trouble.

scaryteacher Thu 31-Mar-11 11:45:32

I'm happy to rent to someone with cats (even had a new backdoor made with a cat flap for the tenants), but not dogs.

pingu2209 Thu 31-Mar-11 11:45:48

Few landlords accept pets, those that do will ask for a much larger deposit, possibly as much as 3 times as much and the terms are changed so that any scratches or chews or urine staines have to be fixed as new etc.

Perhaps you can ask your landlord whether she would accept you having a puppy but offer her 2 times the original deposit which you get back at the end of tenancy as long as there are no puppy marks.

If you are not prepared to do this, I can't see why any landlord should let you have an animal at all.

You only pay Rent. It is not your house. It is not your decision. Your Landlady owns you now.

Hand in your notice. Find somewhere to rent where you are allowed a pet, your home - your life.

minipie Thu 31-Mar-11 12:07:43

Woah there everybody.

OP says "there was NO "No Pets Clause" in Agreement."

In that case, surely, she is entitled to get a pet. Landlady can't stop her, she can only charge her for any damage the pet does (which could be a lot).

Now, I agree it's pretty silly of the landlady to have left this clause out, however since she did, I'd have thought the OP can get the dog?

(By the way OP, does sound like you're a bit optimistic about how much you'd be able to control the mess and damage a puppy would make ... if you like everything neat and clean, you could be in for a bit of a shock...)

JaneS Thu 31-Mar-11 12:13:12

No wonder tenants get screwed over all the time with so many ignorant prats out there! angry And I don't mean the OP, I mean the people commenting here who clearly haven't read the thread and/or don't know the first thing about tenancy law.

The OP has said her place does NOT, repeat NOT, as in 'NOT' have a 'No Pets' clause. She is therefore totally entitled to get a pet. Many people would have sought out a tenancy with no 'no pets' clause specifically, and would be furious to find the landlady changing her mind. Legally, she has no right to stop the OP getting a pet, although of course it would be a very bad idea as the landlady clearly is against it and would charge for repair of inevitable damage/cleaning.

The idiot who trotted out the 'its not your house, you just pay rent' line has really got on my wick. (Can you tell, huh?). A tenant has a 'right to quiet enjoyment'; a right to treat their rented home as their home. The landlady has rights too, but for the duration of the tenancy, providing the tenant keeps to the contract, what she has agreed to is to let the tenant treat the place as their house.

I rent, and of course I do my best to keep things smooth with our landlords. But that does not mean tenants have no rights or that landlords can break the contract at a whim.

DooinMeCleanin Thu 31-Mar-11 12:19:21

Tennants with pets can now get a special insurance to cover any damage their pet might cause to the rental. If you point this out to her she might be more lenient?

What kind of wooden floors do you have btw? We have wood in our house and have had a puppy and a non house trained rescue dog and a cat who pisses when he gets stresses i.e. when we get puppies and rescue dogs hmm and my floorboards aren't ruined. The finish protects them, so long as it's cleaned up fairly quickly. The pets and accidents is exactly why I chose the floors we have. The bare floor boards on the stairs is a different matter, it soaks in straight away and requires much bleaching and scrubbing to get the smell out.

Little red - hope you managed to sort your other problem out - you do sound fed up bless you! As a LL I look on it as it is the tenants HOME and as long as they abide by the rules and keep it in decent condition I dont get involved with it at all......... but it is my house.....it will be my house long after they have left.

Insurance wouldnt make any difference on my outlook to having a pet, I wouldnt want the inconvenience of sorting it out. I think regardless of whether OP has the No pet clause or not...if she gets a puppy and her LL has said no she is asking for trouble and will prob be served notice.

Hammy02 Thu 31-Mar-11 13:40:28

YABU. We rent and didn't even risk having a dog for one night when a couple of friends were coming to stay with us. They left their dog with a neighbour. It's not your house so it's not your decision to make.

emptyshell Thu 31-Mar-11 14:32:36

I rented for years and refused to look at any properties that wouldn't allow me to have the tripod-cat... thankfully I found a letting agency who found the idea of an elderly tripod-cat needing a home quite endearing (and the fact we both... my husband and I, not the cat... had respectable sounding jobs helped a fair whack as well). Have had to pay extra deposits in case of damage (in one case managed to get a 25% reduction in this based on the fact that the cat had 25% less claws), or have had carpet cleaning clauses in the agreement for the end of the tenancy.

Was getting harder and harder to find somewhere to allow us to rent with the cat when we wanted to move out because landlord was shite doing repairs though - mainly because there are so many people chasing rented properties around our way, so letting agencies were getting too lazy to even call any landlord and ask if they'd allow a cat... in the end we bought and promptly got a dog but no way would I have got him in a rental property just in case of the damage - even with a very calm, well behaved older dog - he's still taken paint off the kitchen door and back door, and "improved" the garden somewhat.

poutintrout Thu 31-Mar-11 14:40:09

Going off on a bit of a tangent. I saw the weirdest advert for a rented house on rightmove the other day. Something along the limes of "calling all cat lovers" and it was basically a house that came complete with two cats that the prospective tenant would be required to care for for the duration of the tenancy. Never seen anything like that before...

JaneS Thu 31-Mar-11 19:27:07

Hi desperate - I was fed up when I wrote that, yes! grin Kind of you to ask about the other thing - I really appreciated all your advice on that thread. Basically, we sent an email forwarding them all the communication we've had from them and showing they've sent us out-of-date letters that don't make sense, and contradict each other. We asked them to send us proper bills and communicate in writing, as we think things get missed when they text or leave messages on the phone (and when they send out of date letters, for that matter ...). Got a one-line response with no apology for the way they communicate, saying they will allow us to pay by the end of next month. sad

DH reckons they won't be organized enough to send a bill, mind, as they've not bothered to reply to us about that.

mollymole Thu 31-Mar-11 19:53:57

'no pets' says tenancy agreement - what don't you understand about this - if you want to do whatever you like you will have to buy your own house or find a tenancy that allows pets

JaneS Thu 31-Mar-11 19:59:41

<bangs head on wall at idiots>

<steps away from thread>

Mandy2003 Thu 31-Mar-11 20:03:10

The OP's tenancy agreement does NOT have a clause saying no pets!

But one think concerns me OP, you say that you are so clean you sometimes worry you border on OCD: I am like this and the cumulative effect of shed hair, puddles and piles (or even the pads/paper required to contain it, damage (however accidental), smells (inevitable), greasy patches on the corners of everything (natural oils in the coat)...doesn't do a heck of a lot for you mental state, please believe me! I had a dog staying for a month and was in bits when it left.

shockers Thu 31-Mar-11 20:03:46

mandy, come to mine if you need to race or fence. I'll have to draw the line at high jump though... the ceilings are on the low side.

Mandy2003 Thu 31-Mar-11 20:04:14

Oh, emptyshell I love the 25% discount for 25% less claws smile

Mandy2003 Thu 31-Mar-11 20:06:36

Thanks shockers! This was the original lease written in the 70s, so it couldn't even apply to fitness DVDs either! I wonder what kind of previous behaviour in one of their other properties could have led to this clause I really do. Or what precedent in a law book that they copied out of? grin

gordyslovesheep Thu 31-Mar-11 20:14:55

slightly OT but I recently brought a new build - and it's not lease hold but it still states that I can have only 2 dogs and no chickens !

thankfully I have 2 cats and 3 guinea pigs - no mention of them !

knockinonyerdoor Thu 31-Mar-11 20:51:10

OP we rented and had a cat - the landlord let us bring the cat on condition we put down a deposit with him for any damage. We gave him the equivalent of £250, when we moved out he inspected the house and gave us the money back.

(in fact we got more back because over the 5 years he'd had it he'd put it in a bank account earning interest and he gave us the interest too! did I mention he was a great landlord?)

Why not contact your landlady and offer a deposit to cover any possible damage repair or cleaning that may be required in the event of an 'accident' with the puppy? Perhaps she's worried you might ruin her floors and then leave her with the bill for cleaning.

Heebiejeebie Thu 31-Mar-11 21:16:38

YABU. 'Little man' qv yesterday's annoying abbreviations thread.

Tenancy agreements aside.... As the owner (and big fan) of cavaliers, they're not suited to being outdoor dogs. I see you were considering having him live in the garden They are very much house dogs and incredibly social. In fact I know a couple of breeders who won't let people have their puppies if they're going to keep them in a kennel. They lose the chewing habit fairly early and are brilliant with children's. They're very bright and easy to train - and given the circumstances you're in I think it would be well worth your while to put in the hours to have an obedient and well trained dog. Although you can get away with a walk around the block, they do need regular off leash exercise. They're very energetic so you need to burn that off, then you'll find them less likely to be destructive round the house. That said, much as I love my darling cavalier, he's just a dog and I wouldn't risk losing my home over him. Good luck!

SugarPasteFrog Thu 31-Mar-11 22:25:04

You don't own the house - so if your LL says no to pets then either suck it up or move. Simple.

The last tenant I had who asked permission for a dog - which we granted after many reassurances about how they would repair/pay for any damage etc., cost us a fortune. Every single door had been clawed - too deep to sand out. Every single carpet stank because it had been pissed all over. When I lifted the carpets the backing was actually starting to rot away due to being saturated with urine on so many occasions. We had to pay for brand new carpets throughout - and for a 3 floor house that wasn't a cheap undertaking either. What was particularly galling is that the carpets we had to bin were only 2 years old.

So now, nobody is allowed any pets - and I say that as the owner of two dogs. If you are so desperate to have a pet then you need to make sure that you tailor your accommodation to that requirement. I live in a flat where pets are only permissible by special arrangement. It's written into our sale contract that our dogs are allowed - I turned down lots of other (much nicer!) flats specifically because we couldn't have the dogs there.

So yes, YABU. Bloody well get a grip and stop whinging.

Browncoats Thu 31-Mar-11 22:37:28

Agree with dazzlingdeborahrose, if you keep most, if not all, dogs outside they become more difficult to train IME (granted, not vast experience). Dogs are social animals and the more you let them encounter difficult situations and 'correct' their behaviour on the spot, the better trained they are. If you keep a dog outside it becomes easier for the dog to decide the rules. They're pack animals and need to feel part of a pack.

I disagree with dazzlingdeborahrose on the dog being 'just a dog'. No way, once I've decided to have a pet they become part of the family and there's no way I'd give them up and I WOULD risk my home over him.

I hope you can find a good compromise with your LL - there has been some good advice in this thread.

hugglymugly Thu 31-Mar-11 22:54:49

I'm a landlord, we rent out the house which is next door to us. We use a lettings agency to get new tenants and do the inventory and contracts. Their standard recommendation was "no pets", and that makes sense in our circumstances especially in terms of dogs. Even though the ground floor flat has access to a reasonable sized garden, as owners of the property we'd have to be responsible for securing the boundaries, and that would involve costs to us.

Our agency, though, is very good at assessing people (which is why we use them) and in the past we've accepted their recommendation of a tenant who was reliant on benefits, which has worked wonderfully well. If they recommended to us a possible tenant who had a dog, we'd consider to that. But that would only be someone who clearly demonstrated a good knowledge and long experience of dogs. It wouldn't work for someone embarking on a new experience of a puppy.

we got evicted because we had a child after moving into a 'no children' flat... they didn't mention they were going to do that until our daughter was almost 6 months old... I wouldn't risk getting evicted on short notice over a dog... obviously, we had to keep the child :-)

BitOfFun Fri 01-Apr-11 00:22:54

I can understand your disappointment.

Perhaps, when you've calmed down, you could come up with a few constructive suggestions of how you can minimise any damage/pay for it, and put together a case to persuade her?

It does seems a bit, er, "ruff" if your tenancy agreement didn't specify 'No Pets'.

sunnydelight Fri 01-Apr-11 05:08:26

YABU, it is not your property. We got a puppy a year ago and although I love her to bits she has scratched the wooden floors, peed on a rug so it had to be thrown out (luckily it wasn't the carpet underneath), dug holes in the garden etc.

LittleRed - I reckon your DH is right....your agency sound so inefficient they prob wont remember to bill you!

HengshanRoad Fri 01-Apr-11 09:53:39

YABU. It's her house.

YABU also for referring to your son as your "little man", unless he is actually a pygmy.

I just re read it. Is the OPs little man a dwarf or an elf?

goingroundthebend4 Fri 01-Apr-11 10:07:34

my tenancy says no pets .I have been here a year and am considering getting a puppy as i am at home .The very first thing I did was to email my landlord and ask him before looked any further into it .But ater looking in and weighing things up I ahve decided not to for now

Im lucky he told me can have a dog , cat or what ever i liked .But mines long term rental .The house came with a yard that he brought and I have no neighbours to annoy either

JaneS Fri 01-Apr-11 11:01:56

desperate - here's hoping! grin They didn't tell us our landlady was dead for a year, so it's not unlikely!

I do just hate the attitude some people seem to have - as if anyone who rents is scum of the earth and should be grateful for kindly landlords 'allowing' them to breathe their air.

OMG - a dead landlady and they didnt tell you..oh dear

I love my tenants when they are decent law abiding people who treat my lovely bungalow the way it should be treated and if it werent for you tenants............ unfortunately the few scum bags as usual ruin it for the majority of decent folk!

JaneS Fri 01-Apr-11 12:13:08

I expect it's always like that on both sides - a few nasty and most decent. Thanks btw for being so nice and cheering me up, and it's not even my thread. smile

ZacharyQuack Fri 01-Apr-11 12:19:22

I assumed the "little man" was the OP's minature husband. OP, are you Sophie Dahl?

minipie Fri 01-Apr-11 12:19:57

can people please read the thread

The OP here has a tenancy which does NOT say "no pets"

So she is entitled to have a pet (subject to paying for any damage).

Ok, she'll annoy her landlady. But she won't be doing anything wrong.

Gah.

JaneS Fri 01-Apr-11 12:23:36

grin So mean, Zachery, so mean! grin

BluddyMoFo Fri 01-Apr-11 12:24:53

It doesnt say "Pets allowed" either though...

memphis83 Fri 01-Apr-11 12:25:25

i thought if you didnt enter the property with an animal they didnt have to add it to the clause, my LL has put in ours one dog only, and that we have to get carpets cleaned when we move, making improvements to the house doesnt give the right to do what you want in their house, we have re carpeted whole house but i will still get them cleaned when we move, the last tenant had a cat that caused loads of damage he is currently going through the courts to get back the money for damages. my sister has been kicked out of 2 properties as she has a dog and didnt mention it when she moved in, she tried to argie saying but it doesnt say no pets on the agreement it didnt work

minipie Fri 01-Apr-11 12:26:40

Yes but you're allowed to do anything that isn't specifically disallowed in the lease.

tyler80 Fri 01-Apr-11 12:26:55

Blanket no pet clauses are unreasonable terms in a tenancy agreement. Not that it matters in this case as there was no mention of pets in kid agreement.

I'm so glad we now rent from a company who expect nothing more than the rent paid and the property returned as we found it. Nothing worse than landlords who don't understand that when other people pay them significant amounts of money to live in their house it's no longer their home.

minipie Fri 01-Apr-11 12:28:30

Your sister shouldn't have been kicked out memphis sad unless the lease had come to an end or she was in breach of something else in the lease.

Minipie - my contract doesnt tell my tenants not to set fire to the place....does that mean they can?? A bit extreme but you get my drift........

JaneS Fri 01-Apr-11 13:11:59

desperate, there's a law against arson, though, which covers it! wink

LaWeasel Fri 01-Apr-11 13:13:36

Our contract specifies the existing cat we already have too (and that any poo/wee has to be cleared up straight away!). If something were to happen to him I wouldn't expect to be able to get a kitten just because we'd had a cat before. I'd expect to negotiate, and that probably they'd be sympathetic and another adult cat would be allowed, but I wouldn't have any expectation of any other animal being automatically okay.

I totally understand why LL wouldn't want baby animals in their properties - you can be as good an owner as possibly and you still can't have much control until they are older - and I think it's pretty niave to assume that it will be okay just because the contract doesn't have a no pets clause.

If you went through a letting agency the standard sort of agreement will be that you have to ask written permission re pets and redecoration.

This is what it means to rent.

minipie Fri 01-Apr-11 13:15:04

Thank you LRD

there's probably a clause in the lease about taking reasonable care of the property too, which would also cover it.

LDNmummy Fri 01-Apr-11 13:15:19

Not when you are renting someone else's property, I have been renting for 8 years and wouldn't. It will be more hassle than it is worth.

Hi brown, I'd agree with you if I only had myself to consider but if it was a choice between my children's well being and the dog it would have to be my children. Mind, it would break my heart

I know littlered I just couldnt think of another example grin

JaneS Fri 01-Apr-11 13:25:02

LaWeasal, it's not naive. The OP doesn't have any legal responsibility to ask the landlady's permission, she just has to read her contract, which doesn't say she can't get a pet. Keeping a pet is legal.

Obviously the landlady will probably feel very upset that she's made a mistake in drawing up the contract and will likely use the entire deposit to cover the inevitable mess, so it'd be a poor idea to get an animal.

It's not massively complicated.

I do think in this country we're really bad about ensuring that tenants/landlords understand the contracts they're signing. I've had landlady who didn't understand what she'd signed her name to and made our lives hell for a couple of weeks until the lettings agent finally convinced her she had agreed, it was the law, and she had to do as the contract said.

SugarPasteFrog Fri 01-Apr-11 19:14:11

When a tenant moves in, it's no longer my home - that's true. But when they move out it's me who is responsible for repairing the damage left behind. Blanket 'no pets' clauses are not unreasonable - perhaps consider the fact that most standard LL insurance policies don't cover pet damage! A month's rent as deposit goes nowhere if you have to replace doors and re-carpet.

tyler80 Fri 01-Apr-11 19:19:05

"Blanket 'no pets' clauses are not unreasonable"

The Office of Fair Trading disagrees and considers a blanket ban on keeping pets in a property to be unfair under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. Therefore landlords should not include a ‘No Pets’ clause in their tenancy agreements.

That is not to say there are no valid reasons for refusing pets, just that a blanket ban is not considered reasonable

SugarPasteFrog Fri 01-Apr-11 20:13:57

Maybe - it's bloody frustrating when you are the one left picking up the bill at the end of it though. And I say that as someone who has the pleasure of going to take possession of a house tomorrow where the tenant has done a runner, owing us a month's rent. Every single internal door has been chewed, carpets clawed, ripped and crapped on, skirting board destroyed, wallpaper ripped off the wall, garden completely trashed. I have no idea how much it will cost to put right, but not only am I left holding the bill for the damage but also the void period while repairs take place as I can't advertise it or arrange viewings while it's in that kind of state!

So, my enthusiasm for tenants with pets is rather dampened I'm afraid, as every time someone asks for a pet and I agree to it, it ends up costing me quite alot of money! As a former tenant though, who has always had animals of one sort or another, I do appreciate how difficult it can be to find someone who will agree to take pets. But as I've found out from bitter experience, there are more people who won't bother to sort/pay for damage, than there are those who will.

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