I Feel Really Guilty, Am I?

[Emjxxx]

Right DD 13 is a big handful, have posted about her behaviour on parenting!

Well over the summer holidays she got into alot of trouble, stealing, going missing being the main problems.

The stealing was a phone from one of her friends, her friend got into trouble for "losing" her phone. Then when DD went missing and we were searching her room for any clues of where she could be we found 3 phones in here room, none of them hers (she had hers taken off her a while ago because she was giving her number out to strangers on FB!) Anyway we find out that the phones belong to friends. One of the phones she used and rang up a £276 bill. Luckily the friends phone was a contract phone on her parents business and they had a very good tariff and it meant that once they had all their discount and free minutes etc the bill actually came down to £70. We paid this to the parents obviously.

Well we gave DD a change to repay this money by doing house hold chores, which she hasn't done and point blank refuses to do. So me and DP have decided and have told DD that we will be taking the money off of her Christmas allowance, which means she will only be getting £50 from us for her Christmas present. We aren't going to buy her anything we are just going to give her the money in a card.

I feel soooooo bad about this though, AIBU to do this? should we be getting her the Ipod nano that she wants or should we stick to our guns?

[ShatnersBassoon]

£50 cash sounds like a reasonable amount for a 13 yr old regardless of previous behaviour. You could buy one of everything in Primark with it, so she'll be pleased I expect.

Do you think she deserves an iPod? Has she shown she's responsible enough to have an expensive gadget?

[pjmama]

Stick to your guns!! Her behaviour has been appalling and she hasn't made any effort to make amends. If she doesn't see severe consequences she's unlikely to think twice before doing it again. Frankly I'm not sure I'd be getting her anything at all for Xmas.

[HecTheHallsWithBoughsOfHolly]

Noooooooooo. You should stick to your guns. You must.

The most important thing you can teach your child is that actions have consequences. She's had the chance to earn money to pay back and she has refused.

Perhaps tell her that since she has refused, this is what you intend to do. However, if she does x, y, z before Christmas to earn the £70, then you will not take it off her Christmas money.

Stealing from her mates! That's just awful.

[earwicga]

YANBU

Is your daughter being seen by anybody at Camhs? This sounds like a lot more than normal hormal teenage behaviour. Have you considered that something has happened to provoke this behaviour? Perhaps I'll go over to Parenting and pick up your thread there.

[craftynclothy]

I must be horrible. I'd be telling her she had to do the chores if she wanted anything for Xmas. No chance she'd be getting a nano.

[earwicga]

Can't find it. I only asked if something had happened because I was raped at 14 - didn't tell anyone - my behaviour was absolutely appalling afterwards, for years. The effects of trauma are often mistaken for 'normal' teenage hormonal behaviour.

[LadyOfTheFlowers]

I also think she is lucky to be getting the cash.

I have no experience of older kids - mine are all under 6 - only think back to the things I did and how my parents dealt with them at that age.

[PinkElephantsOnParade]

Do not feel guilty.

Your DD has behaved appallingly and needs to take the consequences.

She is lucky she is getting anything at all for Christmas.

My DD is not quite old enough to get involved in anything like this yet, but if she did I don't think she would be getting anything at all from me.

It is especially bad that she has stolen from friends and got them into trouble.

Is there something deeper going on here? Has your DD told you why she did it?

[Emjxxx]

Hi thank you so much for the quick responses, I had the nano in the Argos basket and was ready to click the buy button (DP would have gone mad)

I know deep down that we're not being unreasonable but god teenagers are good at making you feel bad!

earwicga - She is having meetings with the school counsellor and she is also going to be attending outside counselling via something called 5-18 project in our area, this will start in New Year. Yes there is a bit more to her behaviour and some of it can be understood, but I don't think stealing from friends is one of them that we can forgive or put down to other circumstances.

You are all right she needs to learn that actions have consequences.

Thank you all for the kickupthebum perspective

[earwicga]

Actually, all of it can be understood if she is recovering from trauma. Hopefully counselling will unravel this a bit.

[Emjxxx]

earwicga you're right all of it can be explained, we do know what the ishoos are! and although they are nothing "awful" (rape, abuse,drugs etc) what she is dealing with is very much awful to her and she has been finding it hard to express how she is feeling hence it all coming out in a bad way, so yes we are hoping that the counselling will help.

[mumof2rugrats]

we have done a similar thing for our dd1 she is 7 but she drew on her bedroom wall and pulled the paint of the hallway so we told her that we now have to decorate both rooms so that means sending less money to santa for her presents we still have spent about £70 on her but on 4 presents

[earwicga]

Well, fingers crossed! I hope so too. I agree that you can't suspend normal parenting so still think YANBU.

[Rannaldini]

No of course you aren't being unreasonable.

Maybe though you could let her know that if she does the chores etc and shows a measurable marked improvement you will buy the nano in March?
Just an idea

[hairyfairylights]

No YANBU in fact you are being very reasonable, and she will hopefully learn a lesson from it.

if you don't do this, now that you have said you are going to, she will learn that there are no boundaries and no consequences. This will not be good for her.

[Anniegetyourgun]

Fuck, my 13-year-old's been an angel all year and he'll be lucky to get £50. iPod? In another lifetime perhaps. Fortunately he doesn't expect much.

By all means explore the psychology route if you feel she may have problems you don't know about, but in the meanwhile, boundaries, boundaries. A child needs firm, fair rules as much as she needs love and security. Maybe it is a cry for help (though naughtiness isn't always!), in which case you can always get her an iPod later on, perhaps as a reward for co-operating with the counsellor sort of thing, or at any time she shows signs of being more responsible. But for now, if she's helping herself to other people's stuff, she basically has to stop doing it. It absolutely does a child no favours to let them feel entitled to have shiny stuff just because she's on the same planet with it.

She's "only" 13 now but that's still three years over the age of criminal responsibility (and it was a criminal act, thank heavens everyone was sensible about it) and only five years until adulthood. One day she's going to be in charge of her own expenditure and could get into serious debt without self-discipline - and if she still feels when she's grown-up that she can help herself to anything someone else has that she "ought" to have, that's a recipe for a lot of problems.

[Anniegetyourgun]

Sorry, took so long composing that essay that I missed your last two posts . Glad to hear she is getting help for her problems. However, understanding why someone is behaving badly and letting them get away with it are not the same thing. It's a difficult balance to strike.

[ememum]

YANBU. Definitely.

[Jux]

£50 is more than some parents can spend on each child anyway. DD would be lucky to get that much cash - usually it's more like a tenner or something, though we do spend about £100 on her altogether and my brother is very generous too. Cash though? Very little.

YANBU, not at all. In fact, I think you're being quite generous.

[Emjxxx]

anniegetyourgun you are right, she STOLE that is a criminal offence, we told her this, she is very lucky her friends parents were so understanding and took her apologies and accepted us paying the reduced bill payment.

Yes you are all right, I'm feeling slightly more rational now! Normal parenting must resume throughout and she must learn actions and consequences and boundaries.

Also £50 as stated is not an unfair amount to have, she should be grateful she's getting it, sticking to my guns!

Ooo scared myself then! (not the best at discipline DP is much better than me)Must learn not to be a push over.

Thanks All

[SarfEasticated]

I definitely think you should stick to your guns.

[PinkElephantsOnParade]

Well done Emjxxx hope your DD works through the issues.

She is lucky to have a great mum on her side. And really understanding mates.

[classydiva]

Is there an underlying problem as to why her behaviour is the way it is? Is she having problems at school? Does she miss out on attention at home?

Children do things for a reason, sometimes a cry for help.

Is there something you should be doing to stop her being the way she is.

Generally children are the way they are because of how they are brought up, their social surroundings, the friends they keep.

[spaceman]

'only' £50.00 for her Christmas present .

My two kids are (mostly) angelic all year round, don't get any pocket money and are looking very forward to their £70 Christmas presents this year.

She sounds spoilt rotten. Sorry, but she does.

[thefirstMrsDeVere]

I hope you sort this out with your DD.

If I had read this thread a few years ago I would have thought 'they must be doing something wrong, kids dont just do stuff like that, she is spoilt' and probably a whole lot more.

But I have been through 3 years of abject awfulness with my teen. He does have reasons to be upset (death of his sister, dad's illness, brother's ASD) BUT he has been bought up with strong boundaries, never been spoilt, has been told he is loved and valued and all the other stuff you are supposed to do.

I thought we would get through the teens with a bit of drunkeness and swearing and clip round the earhole.

I was wronger than the wrongest person in wrongland.

Its horrible and scary and soul destroying. You love them, you are terrified about what is going to happen to them, there is nothing like it.

I have spoken to loads of parents of teenagers from friends to people I meet at the library and they are all having problems.

But back to the OP. You really have to stay firm or you will be lost. Confused teenagers (like confused adults) will do the most horrible, selfish things if they can get away with it. They do stuff because they can.