To have been terrified by H's driving?

[pinkypanther]

(D)H and I were driving back from a weekend away late last night. DS (4 months old) was sleeping in his car seat in the back.

We were on the motorway and (D)H was driving a bit too fast for my liking ? he was going above 80 at all times, and sometimes nearer to 90, in the outside lane. I had twice asked him to slow down, as (leaving aside any legal/speeding issues) I don?t like to go so fast with DS in the car. He didn?t.

Anyway, the motorway was pretty empty, but there were a lot of people sitting in the middle lane when there was nothing in the inside lane for miles. (D)H took a dislike to this (TBH it bugs me too) and started driving up behind the people in the middle lane, flashing them, and when they didn?t move over, overtaking them in the outside lane.

He had done this a couple of times (even after I had asked him not to) when he did it to a guy in a silver BMW. (D)H then moved to overtake him and before moving back in again. Unfortunately, the guy accelerated as (D)H was moving back into the middle lane (meaning it was a very close shave when (D)H moved left) and then tailgated us for a mile or two, accelerating to 90 or so, weaving in and out of the lanes, and cutting us up. (D)H continued to drive at 85 or so and (despite me asking) refused to back off or pull over.

I was absolutely terrified by then and when this guy started tailgating us again, I put the hazard lights on (they are in the middle of the car, so easy for the front passenger to reach). The guy then backed off, undertook us, and drove away.

(D)H then went completely ballistic at me, saying I had put us in danger by putting the hazard lights on, that I had ?distracted him from the road? and ?made the situation more dangerous?. The mother of all rows then followed and I asked him why he had refused to back off and he said that ?he was driving perfectly sensibly? and ?was in the right?. I said I didn?t know any father who drove like that with their child in the car and I didn?t care who was technically in the right if we all ended up dead following a high speed smash with some nutter.

So, was I being unreasonable to use the hazard lights (given that I wasn?t driving) or was (D)H being unreasonable to be driving like that? I have said that I won?t let him drive me and DS on the motorway until he has shown me he can drive safely, is this a massive over-reaction?

[trubloffthemouse]

I would be annoyed if a passenger put the hazards on, but equally there's no need for him to sit flashing people in the middle lane if he can just overtake them.

I personally don't think he was driving too fast at over 80 in the fast lane if there was little traffic on the motorway.

If you crash at 70, you're in no less trouble than if you crash at 80imo.

[Topcat11]

YANBU, I wouldn't like to be driven like that either, baby in the car or not. And even if he thought he was driving safely, it was obviously upsetting you and he's a bit of a tit for not realising that and respecting your wishes.

[constantlytired]

YANBU - This is a disgraceful way to drive with anyone in the car, never mind a 4 month old child...he was playing with everyones lives for what?! - A pathetic burst of testosterone. What is it about getting in a car that turns some people into maniacs. I wouldn't let my child back in the car with him again until he can prove he's got this under control...I'm not sure about pressing the hazard lights (being a passenger), but then it wasn't as if you pulled the handbrake on or anything.

[Goblinchild]

Your DH sounds like a testosterone-fuelled nightmare who needs anger management classes. I do a lot of motorway driving, and I'm sick of wankers like him making my life fearful and stressed.
On A roads, I have pulled over and let drivers like him go past, hoping they'd crash and die alone and remove a threat for the rest of us.
I wouldn't go in a car with an idiot like that, ever.

[Goblinchild]

I am a bit nippy on the motorways, so 80 with a calm temprement and sane driving sounds fine to me.

[pjmama]

Your DH was behaving like a total prick. Unfortunatley he came across another total prick in a BMW and between the two of them they put you and your baby in danger. However your DH is the one that started it by being deliberately intimidating to other road users. He needs to grow up and realise he has bigger responsibilities than his own pathetic ego.

You can tell him I said so, word for word.

[Goblinchild]

It's the sort of thing I've warned my DD about, she's 19 and one of her mates drives like this.
Surviving it once was enough for her.
Living where I do, there are a lot of accidents with lads coming off at sharp bends and hitting a sturdy oak tree. Better than another vehicle, but the roadside shrines are a bit sad.

[ivykaty44]

I was out with my dad yesterday and an old range rover tail gated us - literally trying to push us on - he was driving at 40mph - which was the speed limit - then the man was flashing his lights and aorund one foot from the bumper - dad slowed down as at least them if there is a crash it saves you if it is slower - the road was clear to overtake - the tail gater refused to over take, then the road split into tow lanes and he went past..

Tailgating for whatever reason is twatish, I said to dad - you can see whya woman driver would feel intimidated - it is worng and stupid.

Stupid twat - and your dh was doing this - I wonder how he would feel if you were drivng with baby and someone did this to you?

I would explain that next time if he dares to do somthing so stupid you will call the poilcie on your mobile and repot him, you are not afraid to report him to the poilice and of course if he is drivng sensibly it will be you with egg on your face - but if not the poilice will do him....

[tokyonambu]

"If you crash at 70, you're in no less trouble than if you crash at 80imo."

30% more energy in the accident, and it'll take you more than 30% more road to stop.

[sparkle12mar08]

It's the sheer lack of respect that it demonstrates that's the real issue. 80 in sane driving conditions is one things. 85-90 in an agressive manner whilst deliberately antagonising other drivers is entirely another. Would he drive that way with his mother in the car? His grandmother? His boss? If not, then why do you and his own child for goodness sake, deserve any less respect and care? Ask him to try an explain that to you in words of one sylable. Because if he can't you simply cannot allow yourself or your son to be put in such danger again.

[Tamashii]

YANBU pinkypanther not at all. Putting on the hazards probably made the driver behind give up and move on. Situation averted.

My (D)H drives like an arsehole fairly frequently and makes me feel really terrified. He laughs at me if I make any comments and tells me he is a much better driver than me anyway and is in control of the car. He used to drive exactly like you are describing here but would then sh!t himself if someone else started treating him the same way. I'll bet your (D)H got a massive fright when the driver in the BMW retaliated.

My (D)H was driving us home late at night in the outside lane of the motorway and he was going WAY over the speed limit when a car in the middle lane swerved slightly and almost knocked us into the crash barrier. Car in middle lane was going at a "normal" speed but were looking at Sat Nav hence the swerving. If that car had touched us we would have surely have been killed.

I just do not understand why a grown man drives like this. I do know (D)H has issues with control and is quite an angry man. It is not an excuse and I don't get how they can drive like this a) with their DC in the car b) with their (D)W in the car and c)when they are on their own as they could be injured or killed leaving their precious LO and OH to carry on without them.

We had to buy a smaller car recently so he physically can't drive like this now and he seems a little bit calmer when we are out and he is driving.

[Debs75]

The speed isn't so bad on a motorway but the style or manner he was driving in is.

You told him you wanted him to slow down, he wouldn't.
You told him you were scared for yourself and ds, again he wouldn't slow down or drive more careful.

He is a twat plain and simple, there was no need to scare his passengers and by antagonising other drivers he was putting you all at danger.

You switching the hazards on was not going to endanger anyone, you gave a clear signal to the car behind that you were in trouble, he took the hint and backed off then got out of your way. He probably thought you were having engine trouble so would stop suddenly meaning he should get out of there.

If you have your own means of transport than tell dh that you won't go out with him driving again until he proves he can calm down. You might bruise his ego as I'm sure he is a 'really good driver' but your safety is more important

[Tamashii]

sparkle12mar08 excellent advice. Can I take it too? I never know how to express to my H how disrespectful and dangerous his driving is. He would NEVER drive like that with MIL in the car...

I am just glad we had to downgrade the car as it has make a huge difference.

Hope ur ok pinkypanther

[NonnoMum]

Hmmm- been reading another thread recently about dominant men and apparently one classic sign is terrifying driving.

Get help/therapy quick.

Bugger the use of the hazzards etc - the point is his driving was scaring you and he wouldn't listen to your pleas to change his driving.

Poor you - I hope you can sort something out.

[sparkle12mar08]

Spelling it out like that was one of the ways that helped my DH understand just how frightening I found his driving in the first few years we got together. There was many a journey to his parents (2.5 hrs on the motorway) where I would just stalk into their kitchen when we got there and have to spend 15 mins by myself or I would have taken his head off with rage! His parents were brilliant and didn't interefere on anyone's side, but his dad also gave me some very sage advice. Dh takes after him so much and one of the things that did make things worse was nagging him. So I simply stopped talking to him in the car unless he drove appropriately too. And over the years he's mellowed as he's aged, and was driving much more sensibly long before we had children. It wasn't just the level of speed either, it was the manner of his driving. Even round town it was aggressive - accelerating and braking uneccessarily, up to traffic lights etc. And we had to replace two front radiators in different cars because he shunted people whilst tailgating. At £400 a pop that slowed him down too.

Children do complicate the issue because you can't take risks with their safety that you may take with your own.

[HotSprocket]

YANBU. I would be livid, especially when you asked him to be more careful and he didn't.

I feel the same when my dp is driving with dd in the back and he isn't even a bad/aggressive driver, so i can't imagine how you must have felt.

If i had my was we would be going 10mph everywhere though, just to be on the safe side.

[Kathyjelly]

Well you didn't help the situation, I don't think, but I agree with you that if you ask someone to slow down, they should do so out of basic consideration. Why would he want to scare you even if he was certain you were all safe?

Do you have two cars? I had this a while back and I simply refused to get in DPs car until he understood that I meant it. We went everywhere in two cars, which ended up being funny but it got the message across eventually.

[Dinkytinky]

What a twat. Yanbu-you obviously got desperate, I would never ever let my dc in that car again.
Most road deaths are caused by excess speed, and even if he hurts himself whilst driving alone it'll be you that has to look after him and your poor ds who will go without a dad, selfish selfish twat.

[pollywollywoowah]

He sounds a lot like a twat my DH.

[ccpccp]

YABU - never touch the controls in a car when another person is driving, particularly when that person is trying to protect his family from a maniac on the road! What were you thinking?!

You whine at DH for his speed, (85mph on an empty motorway? That really isnt fast you know) then question the way he drives as a consequence of listening to you? Dont like driving in the outside lane, then dont like him flashing lights to make progress past the hogs in the middle lane? Sounds to me as though you didnt like a whole that day. Did you have a whinge on?

When BMW started driving dangerously, it was DH instinct to protect his family and you should have left him 100% in control of the situation. You should have concentrated on keeping DS calm, rather than take control of the car as you did. You failed to work as a team.

[tokyonambu]

I went on a serious track day at the Jonathan Palmer autodrome. You start on stripped out Caterhams and work up, via (back when I went) Evos and Exiges and Renault Clio Cup iron with sequential gearboxes, to Formula Palmer Audi slicks and wings cars.

The lesson I, and most of the attendees, took from it was that I simply don't have the driving ability I thought I did. I have the telemetry from laps in an FPA overlaid with the telemetry of one of the instructors, and it's not even funny. I also learnt, safely, that all that talk about "steering into slides" is total nonsense, as when I was coerced into sliding a powerful car at speed I simply didn't have the reflexes or the speed to do anything about it.

I drove home, chastened, probably 20mph slower than I drove there, and years later (this was 2002) I am still acutely aware of why the speed limits are there. I wasn't frightened by it, just shown the gulf between my driving and that of someone who actually can drive.

I didn't pay for it, but I've said that when my children learn to drive I'll send them on some similar event, to demonstrate that people who piss about playing at racers on the road are numpties. If you want to play at racers, go to a track. Chances are it'll cure you of the delusion that you're a fast driver.

[Goblinchild]

I wondered when the OP's DH would show up.

[Antidote]

YANBU I loathe it when this sort of thing happens. I've hit the fog lights before, but not the hazards.

I have a new tactic now, as going white as a sheet and saying 'please just slow down and let them past' doesn't seem to work.
I did find copious retching noises and searching for a sick bag work a treat up to about 13/40

What I have started to do now is say things like this:
'Do you think we would survive if we crashed at this speed?'
'I suppose we might just be injured'
'If that car crashed into us, do you think a court would find us guilty or them? I suppose we might not get a custodial sentence'
'I treated someone at work the other day who has been tail gated at 80mph. She was paralysed with a broken neck'
'What are the relative masses of our car and that enormous range rover?'
'Were the airbags checked at the last service?' (it's a ford fiesta ffs, the car will be a sardine tin long before the airbag deploys)
'Do we have side impact bars in this car?'

When the baby arrives I am planning a few extra ones about baby car seats. I have also strategically requested that we don't get a new car for the baby on the grounds that there is a limit to how fast you can make a loaded fiesta go. Obviously I've actually said I don't want to have to learn to drive/park a newer bigger car with a new baby and attendant sleep deprivation.

[Antidote]

Just re-read post and realised it sounds incredibly manipulative.

It's more about voicing my fears, and making him think about the consequences of fast/aggressive driving. I genuinely do worry about these things, and I think he does too but sometimes gets distracted.