Would you have used an epipen?

[justtheone]

DS (5 years) has had mild allergies to a number of foods. The most common symptom is itchy, red eyes and very occasionally he has complained of an itchy mouth.
On Monday night he had some halva which I did not know had sesame. After a few minutes he complained of a lump in his throat. I thought that the halva was stuck and gave him water. Then I checked the box of halva and noticed the tahini. My first reaction was to give him some Piriton. While I went to get it, DS lay on the floor. He was still complaining of a lump in his throat and he mentioned a pain in his tummy but seemed to be pointing to his chest. I gave him the Piriton and a few minutes later he was violently sick. After that he seemed better and changed into his pyjamas. Then he said that the lump in his throat had returned and he wanted to vomit again but did not. He then said that he had to go to bed. At this stage I had the Epipen to hand but still did not use it. DH put DS to bed and I rang NHS Direct. They asked a number of questions and said to keep and eye on him. There were no further problems but yesterday his face was covered with little spots which have now disappeared.
This is the first time he has had such a violent reaction. Should I have given the Epipen and called 999? Was I just lucky that the outcome was ok? How bad do the symptoms have to be before you would consider using the Epipen?

[LieselVentouse]

I would have used an Epipen - what did they advise?

[brimfull]

God it's so hard isn't it?This is what I dread,I know I would probably have done the same as you,but I bet you would have been advised to give the epipen.
I am glad he is ok now,how frightening for him and you.

[foxinsocks]

possibly yes - at the point where he lay down but it's SO SO SO difficult to look at these things with hindsight

what did they tell you about using the epipen?

I think you need to take him back to the GP/paed and tell them he's had this reaction.

My first reaction would have been the Piriton too, esp given that he's never had an anaphylactic reaction before.

[foxinsocks]

hope you are ok too

what an awful fright

[LieselVentouse]

Its always better to do something rather than nothing.

[justtheone]

By the time I got through to a Nurse, it was about 30 minutes after the worse of the reaction. While I spoke to them DS fell asleep so they asked me to do some checks to make sure he was asleep and had not fainted. They also asked me to check his rash. I mentioned the epipen and they said to keep and eye on him and if there were any further symptoms to use the epipen and call 999.

I am torn between thinking that because he got over the reaction so quickly, using the epipen would have been rash AND what if he had deteriorated rapidly and I left it too late.

The other problem is that DH is in denial about allergies and thinks that I panic!!! At the time he did not want me to give DS Piriton.

[justtheone]

foxinsocks, DS has had mild allergies from a very young age (

[foxinsocks]

poor you - it is awful isn't it. We were never given an epipen for dd (think they were less keen on giving them out then) and she once had a very bad reaction and lay down on the floor, holding her stomach and then went to sleep. For one terrible minute, I thought she'd died but she was sick and then poorly for a few days.

I know what a dilemma it can be - it's very hard . Sounds like you did the right thing though - perhaps the cracks under his ear lobes are a sort of eczema? Hope the GP can give you something for it.

I think it's important they put his reaction on record - I imagine the allergy clinic will need to know (when you go) too.

Sesame sounds like a tricky allergy because of all the oils it could be in.

(as an aside, we had a girl round to tea last night - I gave them all cornettos for pudding and she said 'it doesn't have nuts on does it, because I'm allergic' and I had not been aware that she had a nut allergy aarrghhhhhhh and we are BIG nut eaters in this house!).

I think you're probably playing the incident over in your mind - maybe you could ask the GP what they think you should do? I don't think NHS direct works for immediate problems does it.

[chloesmumtoo]

MY DD HAS AN EPIPEN TOO. ITS VERY HARD TO KNOW WHEN TO USE IT. I HAVE NOT HAD TO YET. I KNOW A DR I ONCE SAW SAID ANY DOUBTS USE IT. I THINK YOU OBVIOUSLY KNOW IN YOUR HEART WHEN. BUT NOT TO WORRY IF YOU DO USE IT TO SOON. THE AMBULANCE CREW WOULD RATHER YOU DO IT THAN NOT IF UNSURE.

[alibobins]

It is always a hard discision to make and one any parent dreads to think about. Ds has had various reactions but one that sticks in my mind was last summer he came out in red blotches and puffy eyes gave 1 dose of piriton 20 mins later it was getting worse not better gave another dose still no better so decided to drive to a&e to see what they could do. Five minutes down the road Ds started to wheeze and was sick then went limp in his car seat we had to pull over and give epipen and phone 999. I do think this eppisode needs mentioning to gp or pead.

[lulumama]

my DS has a nut allergy, have never used the epipen, only piriton, my understanding was that it is a last resort, if the child;s airways are closing, or they become limp...piriton always seems to help him, luckily

[twinsnikki]

Hello all,

I am an adult and I carry an epipen.

I have reactions to many foods. Last reaction I had was to starburst!!!! I was in a car on a motorway at the time and stopped breathing...

In our house the rule we have is if I am unable take a breath, stab me. I understand with children it is different, as I have a set of twins, not sure what they have reactions too yet..

IMHO if the child is in real distress, unable to breath, I would use the pen, else I would try everything else first. I too get rashes after a bad reaction, but that is usually from the shock my body goes through if I eat the wrong thing...


I think you did the right thing holding off, I would really only use it as a last resort, if the child turns blue or can not take in air...

Nic
x

[alibobins]

I don't think it causes any harm as its produced naturally in the body usually a 6 hour stay in hospital is required as it can cause an increase in your heart rate ( i think)

[twinsnikki]

Hiya Ruby,

After you have given the pen, you have to watch the patient carefully. As they can turn blue, which is a bad sign...

For the person given the pen, it is as if something gives your body a reboot...if you are unable to breath, suddenly it is as if someone gives you a huge oxygen tent..

If I were in your position, I would ask mother to leave you the leaflet that comes in the box, so that you really understand what to look for after you have given the injection.

Hurts when given, but you really don't care at the time!!

Nic
x

[Wimmilymorris]

My DC's consultant always says that you should give the epipen if there is a "multi-system reaction" i.e. several different body systems are being affected.

The body systems are mouth, gut, lungs, skin, heart, throat. So for example,
rash = skin
breathing difficulties/wheezing = lungs
vomiting/diarrhea = gut
rapid, weak pulse/drowsiness/collapse = heart.

But I agree it's so hard to judge - especially when the epipen is supposed to be most effective if used as early as possible. Justtheone - My DS2 also has reactions that come in phases - he seems to recover and then 2 hours later, all hell breaks loose!

Sounds like you did the right thing though

[McDreamy]

I think you did the right thing. With what you describe I would NOT have used the epipen. Hope he is all better now.

[Julia76]

Hi, my son (7 yr old) has a severe peanut allergy. In march 05 he came in to contact with peanut dust and went in to anaphylactic shock, so i obviousaly gave him his epipen. I did not realise he was going in to anaphylactic shock at first and gave him his piriton & inhaler. He got worse very quickly. He had the usual symptoms, urtiaria, itching/sore eyes, feeling sick, tummy ache etc. I gave him his inhaler & piriton & it helped a little, so i did not give him his epipen straight away. I just thought he was puffed out by running around and the smoke in the hall. Then urticaria rash became worse & i soon noticed he had spots in his mouth. Thats when i knew i needed to give him his epipen but my relatives could not find his medicine bag as someone had moved it. That was so scary and of course i panicked. But when his bag was found which seemed like forever he had deteriated quickly and was shaking uncontroably & then soon after became very limp & unresponsive. I knew at this point i had to administer his Eipen, which helped him & brought him out of it almost immediatley. Some may feel i left it too late before giving him his epipen but it all happened so very quickly & like you, (justtheone)i had been wary of giving him the Epipen if not really needed & didnt want to be told that i shouldnt have given it to him by consultants etc. I think as someone else said on here, if in doubt give it. The paramedic told me that if i had not given my son the Epipen when i did he would have been seriously ill or not with us today. So you have to make that decision and if you do give it and they may not have needed it, well the so be it. I understand you cant just give it willy nilly as im not saying that. I think it should be given but only if you have done everything else first and then if still poorly or gets worse then give it. I think if i were you i'd of probably given the epipen but this is probably because of my son's previous anaphylactic. I always tell anyone who looks after my son, if in doubt administer his Epipen,(as his consultant told me this) Of course you also do not want to not give it and wish you had. Sorry for blabbing on but i hope ive helped in some way. x

[Julia76]

Urticaria( soz about spelling mistake!lol

[cece]

I had epipen training today ! I think I would have adminsitered the epipren with those symptoms.

[Julia76]

You can't be too careful, can you?

[cece]

No and there is no lasting damage to using it when you don't need to as far as I could tell today.

[VeniVidiVickiQV]

No I wouldnt have, but, if you had used it, there would have been no 'adverse' reaction (apart from the usual things you get when you get a kick of adrenalin). So, it is not harmful if used inappropriately at all. But if you DO use it, you must ALWAYS call an ambulance, and keep the epipen so they can see how much of a dose of adrenalin has been given.

With anaphylactic reactions they develop very quickly, so, I think if something is going to cause a serious life threatening reaction, it would do within minutes of contact. Therefore, the antihisthamine syrup was perfectly adequate.

The adrenalin would not have prevented the hives that developed subsequently, only antihisthamines would have helped with that.

[tortoiseSHELL]

My mum has the severest reaction to bees I've ever heard of - she was stung, and within 60 seconds was unconcious, within 10 mins she had stopped breathing and her heart had stopped, no blood pressure, nothing. This was the state she was in when she arrived at hospital - I think the doctors were convinced there was no hope when my dad arrived at A&E with her (ironically they were HIS bees that had stung her!). They gave her MASSIVE amounts of adrenaline and fortunately she recovered. If my dad had called an ambulance, instead of driving her straight to A&E she would have died. The doctors said another 3 mins and she would have died for sure (about 13 mins after the sting).

She uses the epipen if there's ANY doubt at all. She had years of desensitising treatment, so hopefully any reaction would be much less severe, but she doesn't take the risk, especially because in that first situation she'd have been unable to administer an epipen beyond about 10 seconds after the sting. So I would say, don't leave it to chance, if a bad reaction seems to be happening, use the epipen!