Gosh time for a new thread already
I'm up for a half term meet - tis the week of the bank hol here 26 May - I will be with sis in Hitchin prob from Sun 25 May most of that week so up for London or roundabout meetup

Ooh, brilliant! It would be lovely to meet you McD.

Thanks for starting the new thread!

Tanee - fab, can't wait to see you again. x

McD wow at yor little dd giving her away i bet you will be very proud, as you say they can be passed as tears of happiness!

Baffy well done you, you should be very proud of yourself. This is the beginning of making new memories that don't involve h at all. You have done all of this off your own back, when he is old enough ds will be very proud of you!

oh my goodness, we fill 'em up fast eh!

good choice of title too.

i'd be up for a half term thing altho bit tricky with working full time.

i have got the friday after the bank holiday off tho.

Just adding this to my list will catch up soon

Hello girlies - another thread already. We can gas can't we!!
TFM - I'm sure it will be nothing, keeping everything crossed for you. Glad P is being supportive and you know we are all here for you.
Baffy - Well done you! You are obviously doing a brilliant job of holding it all together and juggling everything, even if you don't feel like you are at times. Hang on in there, as the others say when ds is at school it will get so much easier.
Tannee - Stick to your guns, why should you sell your home that you love so much. All the things you list that your DP is finding so hard are mostly things we all have to face at some point in our lives. Its not as if your dd is a toddler is she? She's a young woman and I can't imagine her being too hard to live with (not like some teenagers I know!)
I haven't been posting much on here lately as there is nothing to say really. DP is still trying hard not to drink and apart from the odd lapse he is doing quite well. He has got his counselling appointment through for next Tuesday and I'm going to Al Anon on Monday (couldn't go this week as no babysitter and didn't want to tell anyone where I was going!). Hopefully these appointments will put us on the right track, but if not then I'm ready to call it a day really. I'm leaving it to fate, if its meant to be it will work out, if not then I'll be OK as long as I've got my boys.
MacD - have a lovely day at your sisters wedding and push the bad thoughts to the back of your mind. These men need to learn that they can't cherry pick the good times and walk away when the going gets tough.
Sorry this is all a bit jumbled. Got to go out in 2 minutes!!!!

Right, have just finished work so have awarded myself a little MN catch up!

Dior, did you make any progress on the meet-up? I'd like to try and come too if I can. (Hopefully car will work for the whole journey next time and not just half!) I couldn't stop smiling when you said you were so proud. I love the protectiveness we all have of each other! How are you doing? Any nice plans for the weekend?

Ginnedup I'm glad you both have the appointments lined up. You're both doing all you can and hopefully he will show some committment this time and prove he can do it. I think your attitude is great though. Do all you can, but what will be will be. I have everything crossed for you both.

Tanee definitely don't lose the house if you can help it. My biggest regret, and sadness, was that I didn't spot his affair earlier and manage to keep my home. I loved it. We chose the plot, watched it get built week by week, chose everything inside right down to the door handles! It really was 'our' home. I don't think I'll be able to get something on a par with that for a very long time! £60k it cost us. Only 6 years ago. It's worth £160 now!! Imagine trying to get a mortgage on that on my own!!

I can waffle can't I!

Point is though, everything your dp is going through is hard, but in the scheme of things, not devastating to the point where he can't continue and he bails out! I know that's hard to see when you're in the midst of things, but I hope you do get some quality time to talk this all through. Because really, I'd just like to shake him and tell him he doesn't know how lucky he is!!!

HW I've seen some of the fantastic advice you've been giving on the relationship threads lately. And you too lilyloo. I think you're both amazing and you don't know just how much of a lifeline you are to people who come on here so desperately in shock and need of support.
I'm so lucky you're my friends.
You should be so proud of yourselves that not only have you come out of such devastating times yourselves and moved on to much stronger and happy relationships - but also that you have the strength and ability to use the wisdom you now have, and the lessons you've learnt, to help others in need.
You're very special ladies.

I find the support hard right now as it's so raw and difficult for me. But I hope I can get to where you two are very soon

TFM are you ok? How's the garden?

PC haven't seem much from you lately either. How's things? Any news on that house? And H?

Macd how are you doing?

Has anyone seen lilybubble lately too??

I'll shut up waffling on now. Hope you all have a lovely weekend.

Need to admit it - am not coping at all - very tearful, house a mess, paperwork not done, shouty and snappy with DD1 - just don't want to/can't do this alone
Have no idea how I am going to manage when I am back at work (3 weeks monday)

I have those days more often than not too. Don't want to/can't do this alone.


Some things we can't do alone. I know we have to accept that and find ways round it.
But you're coping great. I really think you start to feel like this when you're getting to the point of knowing that it really is over.
Rather than thinking 'what if' and living in some false hope of the old H coming back, you're starting to look at the reality of the future.
I know that it seems crap right now.
But in a weird way, you are moving forward. This is just a stage you need to get through.

Once you get back to work and realise you can do it you will feel better I promise.

I know you'll miss them like mad. I remember that feeling of going back like it was yesterday. But you are doing what you need to do to provide for your children. You are being the best parent you can possibly be.
Which is a damn sight more than he is doing!

You should be so proud of yourself. I know your girls will be.

I wish I was closer I'd help you in a shot.

Thanks Baffy knew you would understand - think you may be right and I have finally realised that the old H is never coming back, that he is never going to change, that I will never trust him enough again - and feel like I have gone back 2 years to when I first found out and am grieving the loss of my marriage all over again - am not going to let him keep walking all over me though it is knocking my self confidence flat.... gotta go to bed worn out with sadness

McD - work may even help keep your mind off it for a few hours and let your brain heal a bit. Big hug coming your way.

Baffy - good, I'm glad you didn't think I was being patronising. I really am proud of all of us. We have gone through so much and most of us are beginning to come out the other side now. We can be here for those who aren't quite there yet!

McD hope your feeling a little stronger today. You can do this am sure Baffy is right in that you are going though the grieving process of it being 'over' not wondering 'if'. That is probably why you feel like you did when you found out, but you haven't gone back two years. You know you can cope on your own, you don't need him, you have your lovely dd2 and you are at the end of the road. You are bound to feel exhausted you have been on an emotional rollercoaster for two years but focus on the future now.
Others have been their and have come through the other side and so will you.

Baffy bloody and that another woman somewhere is suffering again! Honestly am sure we could write a book between us. Sadly i don't think any man would read it!
I suppose it's good to know we aren't alone, but it really makes me want to wrap up my dd's and protect them and to instill the value of trust and honesty in ds, i can't ask for dp's help in that though can i

Hope everyone else ok am going out tonight for my best friends 30th so am off to get ready.

Well he was a total prat this morning (long story been boring RL friends to tears with it so won't go into it again) so I texted him and asked him not to come round the house unannounced when it suits him and he can see kids of course but I would appreciate some notice and some organisation - he ignored me which really riled me (I think this has been bubbling for a while)...
So I stormed around to his shop (with poor little DD2) and basically lost it - told him he was a useless selfish excuse for a father and H, he told me to get out of his shop I told him when he could pay the bills it would be his shop and until then it was in fact MY shop ...he ignored me grr after slamming door....
So I told him he could either discuss it with me, but I was filing for divorce so best he get a solicitor - if I am honest I don't feel any better just sad and tired and have to resist phoning or texting him (I haven't)....and am determined to go through with it - every time I feel sorry for him or sad I just remember how I felt when I found out and every time after that and all the terrible things he did without caring about my feelings and the fact that even now he doesn't seem to care about me at all - he can't even see I am struggling never mind care
Hard day today DD1 has activity after activity, then friend for sleepover tonight so poor DD2 been in and out of car not had proper nap or feed so very tired and grumpy this eve but is finally asleep, and older girls being angels in bed watching DVD with "midnight snack"....house looks like 2 very big bombs have exploded - gonna have tidy up (will make me feel better) glass of wine try and settle 2 exuberent 6 year olds and go to bed......am so tired of it all

McD - have a pampering bath with that glass of wine. YOu need to relax or you will explode.

Hi girls - well, I stay offline a couple of days and you start a new thread. Are we nearing the record for longest ongoing threads?

Well, Cardiff lost and so the hystrionics last night were better than a dose of Eastenders! I just sat back and watched. We're picking up the pieces now, so I'll fill you all in tomorrow - but suffice to say, I've advised DP's BIL to contact Al Anon as DP's sister has a MAJOR drink problem - and he drinks a fair bit too and he was in despair. He's still the most annoying man I've ever met, but I felt quite sorry for him. I feel so sorry for all of them - went to bed about 3am with most of the household in shock - even one of the cats produced a mega hairball under the guests' bed to show her feelings.

Families, eh?

lol @ hairball!

Sorry you had such a bad day though .

Well have managed minimal contact all weekend and TBH I feel better/calmer for it - just texted him today to ask if he was having DD's tomorrow as arranged (I am going shopping for dress for wedding) he actually managed a somewhat civil text back asking what time feels odd but right (though will have to find someone else now to put up my shelves and do my flat packs )...
Small steps forward now we need to talk about the business/finances before my solicitors appt ...still very
Hope everyone had a lovely weekend TFM thinking of you hope you are ok let us know any news x

Feeling a bit of a pratt myself today - had far too much wine and sun yesterday which resulted in me picking a fight with DH . I said some really nasty things too . And the Dc's heard some of it too.
So now i have the guilt of that and a hangover and no weekend left.

So feeling a bit sorry for myself.

DH is being fantastic though (but i wouldnt blame him for not being at the moment). We both know it was the drink - but i still dont feel any better about it.

Thanks baffy for your lovely words, it means a lot to me to have you all as friends.

Have a lovely week everyone.

HW - I think you are entitled to lose it occasionally. He seems to understand that it is a normal reaction, so at least he will take it as that.

Yes you are right dior, I am trying not to dwell on it too much.

Hi everyone

Just popping in to say hello and wish everyone a good week.

HW, one of the reasons I don't drink is that whenever I do my mouth runs away with me and the truth does out don't beat yourself up about it, it will have done you good to let rip

Happy Monday everyone -

MacD - big hug to you - you've made a stand for yourself and your DDs- but I'm sure you are making the right decison - at the least, it shows him that he can't have things his way any more. Good luck with the financial discussions.

GU, let us know how Al Anon goes tonight. I've been checking up on local venues for DP's BIL.

HW, don't be too upset at your outburst - I'm sure H knows he deserves it and will take it in the right 'spirit' .

Dior, glad the hairball amused. Boy, DP's family are seriously dysfunctional! His sister was projecting all her personal misery into Cardiff's loss. She won't recognise she needs help. We managed to avoid them all day - DP and his mum had separate seats and DD and I spent a day shopping for a prom frock (found a vintage Ben de Lisi velvet dress for £20!!!). But they rolled in about 11pm and she fell off a chair trying to remove her flipflops! It just went downhill from then - she was weeping over the match, retreated to the kitchen, started wailing, DP went in to try to comfort her, they got into a shouting match, BIL was in the front room telling me about her alcoholism and how his father warned him and sometimes he wakes up hoping she's died in the night, their mother came down from bed & told them it wasn't fair to me or DD to subject us to their behaviour, BIL told her it was all her husband's fault for what he did to his children, so now she's all upset and barely speaking to them. DD was wide awake in bed listening to all this. DP confiscated any open bottles and all the corkscrews and we took them to bed with us! (now he knows a little of what I've felt like when he's had too much! In fact, I haven't seen DP drink so little for years!

The good thing is that we'll never have them to stay again. I felt like DP's drinking has a long way to go before he reaches his sister's depths! We didn't get a chance to talk about our own problems, but he was very glad to see me and brought me a sample of a curtain fabric he'd seen at Birmingham Market, so I think that, at the moment, he's backed away from the idea of selling up - tentative .

The bad news is that we haven't heard the last of it - every time she drinks too much, he'll be on the phone to DP and we'll get dragged into it, and that always depresses DP.

So for once, someone else in the family has eclipsed our own problems!

Tanne maybe it was good for him to see how out of control things can get with drinking, it could have been a glimpse into the future for him and hopefully enough for him to not like it!

HW been there done that. Funnily enough a close friend of mine has split up with her partner and she was on the phone last night and i was chatting to her and dp was listening and i was symapathising with her telling her all the things we often say on here. It was quite cathartic and i could tell dp had an ear out whilst he was on comoputer. The drink sometimes makes you let go and say things you bury away. I wouldn't feel too guilty as he knows that despite the brave face this will always be part of your life and you will be hurt by it forever. Let him feel guilty but wouldn't advocate it obviously

McD well done you. I doubt you will feel happy about it but you will feel emotionally stronger and he needs to know how you feel and obviously you have to tell him as he chooses to ignore it. You are doing the right thing and well done on avoiding contact other than the dd's.
at you saying it's your shop bet he didn't like that.
Hope you get something lovely for the wedding might be nice to pamper yourself and book some treatments, your hair done etc. before the day then send him a photo of the 3 of you and tell him what a lovely day you had without him!

TFM glad to see your still popping in Make sure you let us know what happens Fri.

Well all ok here dp got a new job to start after our hols, we off to Lanzarote (luckily booked and paid for last year) on Sunday will be glad of the break.

Feeling a bit better now - tried to have a good day with DD.
DH is now coming home tonight after all, as he has re-arranged his day. Just makes me feel even more guilty - but even worse means i will have to tidy up .

No time to read but will catch up in a bit.

Am off work - H and OW up to the old tricks again. Call at 2am. Unknown number. Was OW. Screaming and crying - H beat her up.

To cut a very long story short. He's never ever stopped seeing her - quelle surprise! She's been off the pill for 4 months and he knew that, but continued to sleep with her. Hoped it would all be ok. She is now saying she's pregnant.

They went out last night. Had a massive fight which resulted in them both neearly being locked up. He grabbed her by the throat because she was going mental. She's saying he bashed her head against the wall and hit her! She's now threatening to press charges.

He stormed off from that fight, (then she rang me!! no idea what I have to do with it or what the hell I was supposed to do!) he drove his car, after drinking, smashed it into a wall and has written it off!!

I was on the phone to him for over 2 hours while he sobbed and screamed how he hated her and hated himself and wanted to die in the car! How me and ds are the only good things in his life and he's destroyed that. Er, no shit!
He was standing by the sea, where he lives, so I stayed on the phone, calmed him down and made sure he was back inside safe.

Now aside from my total anger at them dragging me into THEIR domestics yet again! I am utterly disgusted that he has knowingly slept with her without contraception and they may now be bringing a child into their f*cked up lives!!

He's saying he never wants to see 'the whore' again! Bit late for that I think. (And I've heard it all before.)

But - above all, it's confirmed that he's on a self destruct mission that absolutely nobody can get him out of. He's destroyed his life and I can no longer help him. I no longer want to help him. In fact, I'd be happy never to see him again.

I am going round to his with my parents once ds is asleep tonight - no more excuses for not signing the papers. By tomorrow they will be done!

Don't feel any sadness right now. Anger. Disgust. And I can't wait to be free from the 2 of them. He'll never ever learn.

I knew I was doing the right thing. But this has been the final push in the right direction!

I can't believe that someone I've known for 16 out of 30 years of his life has transformed into this monster within 12 months. Scary.

Will catch up with everyone else later xx


p.s. when do you think a soap opera will want the rights to this story?! I know it's a bit far fetched for a soap, but I'm sure they can tame it so it's more believable!!

Oh Baffy what a nightmare - she has serious problems with you and is trying to get to him through you, at least you know that neither of them is truely happy. I dont think she ever will.
You have given H a son and turned him into a father that is something she will never take from you and she knows that. Even if she does have a child with him it will not be the same and she knows it.
You are fantastic and i think you are right to get the papers signed asap - he is more of a liability at the moment.

I am so sorry he seems to be on a self-destruct mission, I remember when my DH was just like that and it is so scary to watch. I do think he needs to really hit rock bottom before he can get himself out.

We are here for you if you need us.

Baffy - I am . These two bring you into thier domestics and rub your face in it time after time. You are a saint.

Tanee - wow, what a family! The hairball did make me chuckle though!

My life at the moment has gone back to nothingness. No hugs or cuddles, although h is doing the 'fun' winding up that he likes to do, so I think he respects that going on Xenical is my attempt at losing some weight. I am the biggest I have ever been and don't really blame him - I wouldn't want to touch me either.

Dior - i meant to ask how it was going? I do understand about your weight but you are sitll fantastic to me.

Baffy wrt to the soap opera i often wonder if we should certainly make something of all these wonderful stories.

Baffy, my God - you've trumped DPs' lot again! I am so sorry for that baby - if there is one - what a mother for it to acquire. Honestly, the texting and phoning at 2am certainly sounds like my weekend guests - they do the same thing to DP and his mother in the middle of their fights. His mother once called the police on them and BIL spent the night in the cells.

You are doing absolutely the right thing in getting him to sign those papers. They need to sort themselves out without dragging you into it.

But I am so sorry that you've had to reach this conclusion. I totally understand how hard it must be to realise that the man you've loved and supported for half your life, doesn't exist any more - and it's his loss.

Dior - sorry things are not great there - I don't understand your H - you are such a Lovely Person (ditto Baffy) - I look at the two of you and wonder why any men would treat you the way your H's have.

HW - I agree there's a book in our stories somewhere - maybe I should start writing that novel now! At least we'd get some royalties out of the plonkerness of our men .

Baffy i hope he is signing them papers as i type this.
I am also glad that you know you can't help him. He is determined to ruin his life and sad as it sounds there isn't anything anyone can do.
TBH i wouldn't even answer the calls in future you don't owe either of them anything and they deserve to be left to deal with their own mess. You are really doing the right thing i hope he feels thoroughly ashamed when you go round with your parents tonight!
As for the pg we have heard that before haven't we!

Well, h is totally going back to form. Came home tonight and got all stressy about the MOT, which is due on Friday. Admittedly, I am not the best person to arrange these things because I do tend to forget them. But, I tried three times to get hold of the service desk and, when the person rang me back, I had taken ds to Beavers. So noe h is stressing that they won't be able to fit us in.

I wouldn't mind but he is now trying to pick a fight with me about how he has been telling me to sort it out for two weeks (erm...no you haven't). And, he tried to pick an argument with me about it, which I wouldn't rise to. He is now in a huff and saying he will arrange it because I 'can't be trusted' to do it. No, but I can be trusted to look after his child for him .

Aaagh Baffy what a twunt 2am bloody hell - TBh why did you spend 2 hrs on phone to him you shoulda let him jump
OW sounds like my H OW desperate and telling him she will get PG on purpose doesn't seem to matter they just don't get it Idiots all of them
Well H did his usual about turn today (he had LO while I went dress shopping for wedding)...all sorry and begging for forgiveness he will try harder he will help he can change blah blah blah heard it all before - asked him to come round one morning so we can talk properly and am going ahead with solicitors appt ....

Dior -sorry you seem to be back where you were before. If there is anything I can do please do ask.

McD - remember how strong you felt with a bit of control - please do keep the soliciors appointment - it really was the best thing i ever did as it stopped me ever being afraid of it again.

Baffy - I hope he did sign the papers too. You will then be able to control your life a bit better, i also agree that you should not have to take his calls at such hours - he does it because he knows he can ifswim.

As for me - I have had a lot of the old feelings of anger come back recently - and to make it worse there is someone at DHs work in a similar position (him same level as h and having an affair ). There is a new person in HR and they have sacked her on the spot and are 'thinking' about what to do wrt to him . There is now going to be a policy made - about bloody time too. I think it just makes me so cross that they do it now but not for ow .

Also a slow on getting on with h departure - the boss wants to handle it with care (think he is worried he will get flack because he actually promoted ow - and i still do believe if the truth be known the vote would be for her to go and not h). I just want it done now and to move on.
My head says it is for the best because actually h will come out of this looking good - but there is an evil little voice telling me to make sure she has a hard time of it too. And that makes me feel cross with myself for even letting it worry me and for actually not being a very nice person to wish such things.

I still dont think they have deleted all the emails between the pair even though i said it would be a good idea over a year ago . Apparently no-one will be interested in them anyway - well i feel like saying if that is the case then once h has gone i will send them to some of her collegues. See i am evil arent i . I feel my feelings have been totally ignored and what i feel about it doesnt matter one jot. Which is probably true anyway.
Also just keep thinking about the wife of this new case at work and wish there was something i could do - i did offer that if it happened again i would be willing to help but again they probably think that is a silly idea - what do i know about anything anyway.

Sorry feeling sorry for myself again - but the rant does help somewhat so thanks for reading.

On a brighter note - garden is looking fantastic and should be finished soon - i have a lovely new lawn (only for looking at for a couple of weeks - but it does look great). Hope you are all still praying for that overnight rain for me .

Morning ladies

He didn't sign! Point blank refused to. It's not what he wants!!
Short of actually physically forcing him to do it there really was not much more we could do.

My parents were literally lost for words. 'He's just not on this planet' was uttered many times!

Totally agree that I shouldn't be answering to them. And if it's an unknown number and I answer without realising, just put the phone down.
Thing is though, H lies SO much that I have always spoken to her because it really is the only time I find out (a version) of the truth. Neither of their stories ever match. But if taken with a pinch of salt, I can get the general gist of what's happening and not feel so in the dark.

But this is why I need to divorce him. Because I don't want to care about all this stuff anymore. They are literally killing each other. And I'd like to leave them to do it! As his wife though I have a need to know and a need to understand what the hell is going on behind my back. I hope you can understand that.
So I want to stop being his wife and move on for good.

Macd trust me - I was tempted to let him jump!
OW did her usual 'I'm going to throw myself off a motorway bridge' at 5am that morning too. I told H just to let her do it. Or if she needs a push to give me a shout!

Anyway, thanks lily I know we've heard it all before about the pregnancy. I hope that's the case. Either way though I will never ever forgive him for taking those risks.

(There is a massive long story which I'm not sure I've told you but my dad had an affair when my mum was pregnant with me, I have a brother 6 months younger than me, we only met 2 years ago. And me and my mum are having major trauma at dredging up the past and having to face my dad's OW. I love my brother and he is totally innocent in it all. My mum is great with him too. I feel devastated that we've missed 28 years of each other's lives. But him and SIL have recently had a baby and she is being christened this week - and I will have to face my dad's OW properly. The woman who wrecked my mum's life and changed my childhood beyond all recognition I'm going to be civil and polite. For my brother's sake. But all I want to do is tell her exactly what I think of her - she got pregnant on purpose to try and keep my dad! It will take every ounce of strength I have to face this woman. The nights I sat and cuddled my mum while she cried herself to sleep over what my dad and her had done. That will never leave me.)

H knows all of this. Every last detail. He's lived through it all with me since I was 15 and found out my brother existed.

Now he's done it to me! Exactly the same thing!

And what I will never ever forgive is that he is now potentially going to put our son through the same thing!

30 years on from my dad's affair and me and my mum are still dealing with the fallout.
And H is prepared to do that to our son without a second thought. That is a conscious decision to put sex with her above mine and ds's future. I can forgive him for everything. The affair. The way he's treated me. But never for that.

I do go on don't I!

Dior I'm so sorry you're having such a bad time. I hate the way he makes you feel. You are absolutely beautiful and I wish with all my heart you had a partner who made sure you heard those words every single day


HW what a nightmare. I'm not surprised you're so angry with the way this new case is being dealt with compared to how she was almost rewarded for being such an immorral sl*pper! Again, it's the reprocussions of these affairs that last for so long, and cause so much heartache.
Don't be hard on yourself for wishing her a bad time. I'd be more worried if you didn't have those thoughts every now and again! She almost destroyed your life. And appeared to walk away with no reprocussions and a promotion! Whilst your H had to take 6 months off and now needs to find a new job!
It's totally natural that you feel that way. I would be exactly the same. I am exactly the same!

As for 'what do you know'... well a damn sight more than most people when it comes to affairs and relationships! It's wonderful that you have made that offer to help. You know exactly what that poor woman will go through if when she finds out. Your advice and support could be invaluable in that situation. I've seen it many times on here! So don't put yourself down.


macd totally agree don't back down on the solicitors appointment. It will give you some control back. It's good that you are talking though. If he wants to change, my advice to you would be to continue down your current path, and let him prove it. You owe him nothing. Keep taking those steps forward. He'll either rise to the challenge, or let you down again. But don't let him throw you off course with a few cheap words. We've heard it all before

Baffy
H has got another job and even though neither of us dared even dream it - it looks as if it is more money .

Current work are reluctent to announce his departure yet as it really will have huge impact on business (and that is not just me being big headed here you understand). The boss knows he should have 'sacked' her and that will probably now be called for but that is not what we want now (well i do but i also know we will look so much better in the end). His boss is understandly fuming as it will make him look bad - and there is nothing he can do really as H already has offer and it is for a firm where H could ultermatly take bussiness away from current firm . There is a lot of gritted teeth from all accounts - those that do know are holding their breath and ow (who does know - is staying well away as she must know she is in for a rough ride). So its still watch this space.

This is going to be some great new soap opera soon.

I would love to help the wife but of course men think they know how to handle it so probably wont give her my details .
They also havent thought that the ow may of course still kick up a fuss as my ow was in fact promoted and not sacked. God what a mess.

I am with you baffy that the re-precussions just never end and the stupid men just seem to carry on even when they know what a mess it all is.

Hs Dad did something similar and married ow - I have made it quite clear i have zero respect for her (its got easier as i have got older to voice my opions though), and it was all brushed under the carpet - the subsequent children i am sure do know but would never dare ask.

What are you going to do know wrt papers are you going to get a solicitor to send him a letter - there is something you can do i am sure. Good luck.

HW that is fabulous news about H's new job. I bet the firm will be devastated. They're losing a great member of staff, and the potential business he'll take with him. All for sticking by the OW!

You're right she will have a bloody rough time coming up. The expectations on her will be massive. Not only to be better than H at the job to make up for losing him (which she could never be) but also to retain business and get new business etc. The pressure will be on!
And really, you don't need to know much more than that. What goes around comes around and all that... she's about to see the full effect of that!

You and H can walk away with your heads held high - and with a little smile too!

I'm not sure where to go now with H. I want him to sign as things are. We've agreed on access to ds, maintenance, how that will be reviewed going forward. Neither of us wants to make a claim for anything financially from the other one. Just a clean break. I am so reluctant to get solicitors involved as I know for a fact all that will change and it will end up getting nasty and bitter.

I'm going to plead to his better nature Rather than try and force anything, I think I am going to try to make him understand why I need this and how unfair he is being to me and ds by trying to string me along whilst his girlfriend is on the scene. I actually feel like I'm the OW right now. In my own marriage!

I know he has empathy left. And guilt. I broke down when he had a go at me about his access to ds saying he doesn't see him enough! What does he expect - me to send my baby off into his and her explosive relationship while I sit at home alone! He did then apologise for that comment and understand that he's actually getting a pretty easy ride considering what he's done.

I've made a promise that I'll never deny him access to his son. Which I never ever would. But we need to do this amicably and agree on it all. The minute a court starts calling the shots it will all fall apart and get nasty. I don't want that for my son

It will all work out in the end

Oh Bafy - you are the ow (what comes around...) and that is why she is hating it so much she knows what a liar he is.

Actually she is not getting his job - there is going to be 3 (yes 3) taking it over!! Thats just how good he is - but thats because he can work all the bloody hours and have me to 'look after' him. . She said a while ago that she didnt want to work with him anymore so once again they bent over backwards for her and found her a new position. (she will be kicking herself now - or throwing another paddy to try and get part of his job for herself) And i really dont care. (much).

When he first said he wanted to leave i think they thought he was just stamping his foot and wanting them to sack her (he is not like that and does not do bluffing), Now of course there is nothing they can offer to make him stay.

Once he's out of there you'll never have to give her, or that place, another thought. You're through the worst. This is payback time. And it's all taking it's natural course. You should be so proud of how you've both dealt with this. You'll definitely have the last laugh here!

Yes I guess I am the OW. With none of the bloody benefits though!! I just get all the crap parts and the hassle. None of the excitement or sex! She hates me even being in his company though.
And tbh, I'd never want to 'go there' again, god knows what he's caught from her!!

Thats what i am hoping baffy but his does have a long notice period and i just want it to happen soon. I also feel sad because he really did love his job and worked so hard too. But at least i will be able to support him in his new job without feeling in anyway tainted. I am actually so proud of the way he has done this too.

no consolation for what you have lost i know but at least you know she has not 'gained' that wonderful man in anyway, just make sure that when you are feeling at a low ebb you make her feel it too by having contact with him. (wiked i know but only human ).

Thanks for listening today.

Oh don't you worry. If he is set on a future with her, aside from the fact they'll kill each other without my help, I know how badly she suffers from the green eyed monster and after what she's put me through, she won't be getting away lightly!

If I'm so inclined I could really have some fun with that! I bet I'll just be that relieved to be rid of the 2 of them that I'll leave them to destroy each other all by themselves!!

btw he has worked so hard and that has enabled him to have this choice to move on. it's all good. when one door closes and all that...

Excuse an occasional lurker from butting in, but...

Baffy, my XH refused point blank to agree to a divorce, wrote a rude letter back to my solicitor, kept saying I would have to leave without DS4 and pay maintenance, then when he actually got a petition from the court he caved in. My solicitor (a family law specialist) said in his experience 95% of them do the same: bluster and posture at first, then go all to pieces once they realise it is serious. We have now come to an agreement which is what I wanted in the first place, ie a 50-50 split of everything including access to DS4, the divorce is through and we are just waiting for the court to rubber-stamp the financial consent order. There is no need for it to get nasty just because there are lawyers involved, if you take care that it doesn't.

You aren't going to persuade your H to sign out of the goodness of his heart, because he hasn't got one (the slut ate it). He prefers to keep you on a string while he fritters away your children's inheritance. A good stiff letter from a lawyer may make him pay attention, failing which a court summons. Adultery is grounds for a "quickie" divorce in this country, or if you just want out you could agree to let HIM divorce YOU on the grounds of unreasonable behaviour, if that makes him happier!

So don't despair, pick up that phone, get some quotes from good family lawyers, find one who will agree to write only polite letters, and sue the breeches off the bastard. Er, I mean, divorce him in a civilised and dignified fashion.

Excelsior! With the emphasis on Ex.

Love, Annie

Baffy - I am really cross that he won't let you go. He can't have both of you, and I really do think that you must go down the adultery route to just get him away from your life. Grrrrr. And a big squishy hug to you and ds.

HW - brilliant news for h! I am so pleased for all of you.

Wow! Baffy I'm so and for you. What a pair of ... well I just can't think of a bad enough word without offending anyone and using a word I never ever use!!!
Annie lol at "the slut ate it". That's very true
Well I went to Alanon last night and P had his counselling today. We managed to have a really good chat this afternoon and we are really going to make a last effort to make this work (and it really is the last chance, if this doesn't work then that's it, I've done my absolute best and can't do more)
Alanon was good - not really what I expected and it was mostly older women there (I thought I'd stumbled into a WI meeting at first but they were all so kind and I felt really relaxed and at ease with them all. I'll definitely go again, and am quite looking forward to it actually.
Tannee I'd definitely recommend it!

Thanks for posting Annie that's really good advice
I have already seen a solicitor. But it just wasn't feeling right and I chose to fill in the forms myself. I've done all the forms and have put adultery as my reason for divorcing him.

Although I ran out of space in the bit where it asks for evidence, dates and locations!!

I understand from my meeting with the solicitor that I can file for divorce without his signature and he will just receive the Petition. That's the point he needs to sign for the actual divorce (I think!). The bit I need him to sign though is the 'Statement of Arrangements' for ds. I wanted him to sign that so it's all 'done and dusted' so to speak. That has to be sent off with the Petition. If we both agree and sign to it, then he just signs the paperwork when he recieves it and it's all done. (Simplistic summary!)

So I can actually go ahead and file for divorce without his signature, it just means we may then have to go to mediation or something over the arrangements for ds. That's the bit where I think the slut, and his family, will start getting back into his head and telling him to fight for joint custody and not agree to the maintenance as I earn more than him etc... I just don't want it to come to that We both agree at the moment and I'm scared of people manipulating him into fighting me.
We know how weak and easily led he is!

Sad thing is too that he's not contesting the arrangements for ds at all. He's knows I'm being more than reasonable given the circumstances. He just doesn't want to divorce me!

The longer this goes on though, the more scared I get that he'll not only take my home from me, my future as I thought it was, and every ounce of confidence I ever had. But also my baby. I couldn't deal with that

Annie I think I will take your advice and try to find a solicitor I feel happier with to help me move it forward.

At least I'm still smiling though. Somehow!

Thanks for the hugs Dior. Much needed!

And great news ginnedup I'm so pleased it went so well for you. You're sounding more positive than you have in ages

I can imagine how scared you must feel that he would fight for custody. But with the evidence so far do you really think he would stand a chance? I mean with the police getting involved and everything.

Like you say if he signs he sort of gets what he wants - surely he knows now that you will be calling all the shots.

I do wonder about the money you earn though and i know that my solicitor was saying to me it would be in my best interests to stay 'married as long as possible - to get more 'years' and also more of the share. I know that is not what you want to hear but maybe he is thinking along those lines too, you have been his life-line for a long time now and of course he does not want to cut that. Anyway wishing you lots of strength to get you through this. Do at least talk to another solicitor so you know all your options if he is playing dirty.

Ginned - glad your meeting went well and hope it does all work out this time for you.

Baffy I cannot believe how similar our situations and Hs are sometimes I think you are me ...just younger thinner and prettier
What on earth is he playing at - he doesn't want a divorce but he is still with skank bitch ...trust me she will get PG if he gives her half a chance - I worked out OW got PG probably the week she realised "she had lost" - H had put his wedding ring on and asked me to do the same ....and I foolishly told her
Afraid I did the same as you and told her she could never trust him, I would always be there, I was the mother of his beloved daughter (the only one at that stage ) and if I wanted him I would just have to click my fingers ...silly me I sometimes wonder if I had fought her less hard for him whether it would have just burnt itself out and me fighting so hard just fuelled her obsession (and his)
When I filed for divorce initially 2 years ago - he told me his solicitor told him to fight for half my pension (I have excellent NHS pension he has none)..and also fight ME for maintenance payments as I earn so much more than him (fuck off I also look after his kids provide for them support him and run his business) aaaaggghhhh he always said he wouldn't do that but I know what you mean about being worried how others (especially OW) will influence him - I also wanted will stating that OW baby had no claim on anything we owned jointly (wehy the fuck should she take away from my kids) so now gotta go through all this again
Oh HW you sound so angry at the mo - is it because you feel she has "got off scot free" - just remember you have H and he certainly seems to have tried his very best to prove its YOU he wants
Dior bloody H of yours how dare he make you feel so bad - mine did the same and the damge he did goes deep Althoughmanaged to fit into a size 16 dress for the wedding!!
Same old same old here H on best behaviour as always after I lose it...but am ignoring him much as I can even forgo my usual night out tonight as he usually babysits and really don't want him here ....
On a more cheerful note I will be in London from Sun 25 May anyone still up for meet doesn't need to be in London - in fact just outside London where I can drive to rather than train/tube would be better...will start thread on FB more private to arrange meet can put mobiles etc ......come on someone meet me I missed the last one

Baffy i'm sorry he didn't sign but can't say i am surprised. Good point there Mc maybe if you do stop fighting/ supporting him he may realise what a twunt he is being
I doubt for a second you would ever loose ds he hasn't a leg to stand on when compared with you.
I agree maybe find a solicitor who is prepared to move forward he way you want as i feel until you get force him to divorce you he still thinks you are their for him when he changes his mind on her!
At leas you know that man who you loved and had a child with is gone and she has been left with this 'other awful' person, i can imagine it wasn't nice for your parents especially considering their background.

HW i wonder if it's the other thread that has raised the feelings again, i similair and sometimes think i should stay away from them as it is really close to the bone. Congrats on him getting his new job though that's going to make things much easier.

Dior sorry to hear things not good again.

Gup lol at the wi meeting. glad it went well.

McD glad you sound stronger and his 'good' behaviour isn't wearing you down, keep going you can and will get through it!

How's Pc is anyone in touch with her ?

Hi Lily I have to stay off the other threads - I just end up in tears and cannot be constructive like you, Baffy and HW just want to be bitter and angry and really need to change those feelings or I am going to end up a sad old hag

McD you are just under too much pressure yourself at the moment, no one could expect you to do anything more than you are.
A bitter old hag , never !
Hows lo is she rolling , sitting yet ? Have you started weaning i holding off as long as poss, havebreathed sigh of relief it's now 6 months. Can't stand all that pureein fruit and veg!

Thanks everyone - yes it could be the other thread that has triggered things but i also think it is because although he has another job it is still 'secret' and there is a long notice period to go. I am just so impatient and just want that next step and new start NOW. I want his work to finally realise that it can not work if both work there (and even though i know they never will) want to know that they wish they had sacked her. Well at least they do seem to be at last getting a policy in place so no-one will have to go through this again.

Also know i am getting quite stressed at the mo too and i am fed up with workman in my house - i just want to have my home back - but its not long now.

Sorry for long gap in reply (commuting, counselling session, game of Solitaire, the time soon goes!) It is not necessary for both parties to sign the Statement of Arrangement when you first send in the petition, though obviously it's simpler if he does. Mine signed it, but then I think regretted it as it gave me the primary care role, so he refused to sign the decree nisi. Six months later we were entitled to apply again, and I revised the statement of arrangement to give us 50-50, which is actually what I'd wanted in the first place. This time the court put it through without a quibble. XH had been a more-or-less SAHD, at least he spent more time than I did with DS4 including taking him to school, so he had not only the right but the inclination to continue caring for him at least half the time (not that he did it very well, eg he has never bathed him in his life and has a tendency to feed him at 11pm even if it means waking him up). You've been the primary carer, you'll get primary care rights through the court, no problem. Just send those papers and let him explain to the court why he won't sign. He won't do it for you because he still thinks of you as his personal doormat (hence the calls in the small hours, to ask for sympathy from his deserted wife because his lover is so annoying he HAD to beat her up... planet what? If you weren't there he'd have to pay a counsellor to listen).

HW completely agree stressful situations do aggravate things. I have felt it more with dp getting new job and loosing his buisness.
Can i just ask and feel free not to answer if you feeling 'wobbly' do you speak to h or not ? I just sometimes feel like i have agreed to move on and don't know if bringing it back up will make me feel worse not better. And i know he would rather do anything than talk about it.

Thanks Annie. Your posts always make me smile.
"hence the calls in the small hours, to ask for sympathy from his deserted wife because his lover is so annoying he HAD to beat her up"

And it's really good to hear that advice. I assumed if he signed the arrangements over ds then that was it, and he was bound by it. But I never realised he could just refuse to sign the decree nisi anyway, which he probably would. So I might as well just get on with it and then he'll understand how serious I am and we can fight come to an amicable agreement over the details at a later date!

Macd thanks for that too. I can't believe how similar our situations are sometimes! You sound like you're coping really well.

Know what you all mean about other threads being too close to the bone. I really do have to be in the right frame of mind to read and post on them. Sometimes I just wants to rant and rave about OW, morals, not being taken for a mug etc!
I have to keep finding my sensible head, to realise that even if on the surface it seems you understand, every situation is so so different. And really, you only ever learn from your own experience and no matter what people advise you, you have to live through it your own way and find the answers that suit you.



lily I know from my limited experience that the absolute last thing in the world H wants to do is actually discuss what's happened and the fallout from it in a grown up way. they do not want to be reminded how much of a bad person they've been, or re-live the feelings of guilt/remorse/shame... easier to bury their heads!
I would say, that perhaps you need to say to him that from time to time, you still struggle and although you realise how difficult it is for him, you may now and again need to put some time aside to discuss your feelings. And you need him to help you through with them.
I know it's hard. But why should you deal with it all in your own head and bottle things up for him? He was man enough to sleep with another woman. So he needs to be man enough to live with the consequences.
This isn't about him. It's about you. You need to do what gets you through it. You've suffered enough. Don't suffer in silence xx



I had a major strop tonight! In ds's room at H's place were some photos of the 3 of us when ds was born. They've been there since the day he moved in. I picked ds up tonight and he was playing in his room, I went in and photos were gone. In their place was a teddy that slut guts made for him for his 30th!! The day we were back together and out celebrating. He'd sneaked off to get his present from her! And the teddy!
I waited for ds to go out the room and virtually threw it at his head! If it would have been a hard object I'd have made sure my aim was spot on!!

H is absolutly fantastic - we both discuss it a lot at times - i know he talks to others about it too, so i know for him it is not just 'fogotten'.
We have friends who have gone through similar too and so it is so very hard to avoid.
We do not go to counselling as much any more just when we feel we need to - in fact we are hoping to book another session soon just to make sure we are still on track.

So although he is not 'happy' to talk about it he also never stops me and is very good at picking up the signs. He will come over and hug me for instance if there is something sensitive on the TV. Her name sometimes causes a bit of a problem but we do try and have a joke about it. My DD will often call her dolly her name (and also DD has the same birthday ).

He has had to have some contact with her at work and she has made sure of that too - he now says he hates it so sometimes it is me comforting him too.

Most of the time we are a team and dont often both get down about it at the same time. Him coming to counselling has also helped as he can 'remind' me of how i can best cope.

Hi everyone

Not around much today as meeting an old friend for a catch up and we can both talk loads too .

Anyone heard from ernest - she must be about to pop by now?

Nope haven't heard from Ernest at all. Hope she's ok.

Have a good time with your friend today HW

HW, that's great news about H - you and he will be able to smile on all this one day.

Baffy, I've given up trying to understand why he won't sign - maybe the others are right, and he has some financial incentive - or maybe it's just some part of his sad, messed up mind. Hope you find a solicitor who's better able to guide you through this. A good one shouldn't cost you the earth or make things nasty. Mine was great (mind you, we didn't have any money to fight over, to speak of, and exh was very gentlemanly about how we divided our assets - though I get precious little out of him now, despite the fact that he's probably not completely broke since his father died and must have left him something).

Oh, and judging by events, there is NO WAY you would lose DS - no court would grant him custody under the circumstances.

Thanks Tanee.

I'm a real mess today. It's sunk in that it really is over and he's just not the man I thought he was. I have the papers completed, without his signature, and ready to post. I just need to find that final bit of strength to push then into the letterbox! I walked there at lunch time and I was shaking uncontrollably and my heart was pounding.

I couldn't do it.

I've walked around aimlessly for hours just trying to get the strength to do what my head tells me to do. For some reason my heart just won't let go.

I'm back in work now trying to make up some time and all I'm doing is staring at the screen. I can't focus.

I know I need to sort myself out. I know that there is no choice and the things he's done to me are beyond forgiveness. Even beyond my limits!

I can't eat or sleep though. I thought I felt all the hurt and pain when I found out about his affair. But my god this hurts like hell.

Just one more thing before I go and try to pull myself together for ds.

I need to thank you all for being by my side through this horrendous journey. 18 months of rollercoaster emotions and lies. Heartache. Devastation. And you've all been there every step of the way.

I'm sorry for going on. I promise I will get stronger and I will do what I need to do and stop boring you all with this nightmare.

Thank you though. From the bottom of my heart xx

Oh Baffy - Don't push yourself, do it in your own time, you are under so much stress at the moment and its all credit to you that even after all this you still feel something for him which is preventing you from taking that last step towards the end. I guess what I mean is, keep the letter in your bag and just wait until you pass a postbox and feel ready to put it in.
((Hugs))

Baffy completely agree with gup do it when you are ready , i am sure it won't be too long before he does something that has you running to the nearest post box!

Hw wow that sounds great and completely different to how things are here. You are doing so well keeping communicating as this was somehting we and am sure most feel is what pushed things in that direction. We only did two counselling sessions and i guess things aren't as prominent as he doesn't see her anymore however now he is starting a new job i guess the feelings are resurfacing again. When he had his buisness i guess i knew there was only him and it was just down the road. Now it's a big company not far from where he was working with her.
Baffy you are right it is about me and not him i do need to talk it through with him when i have a 'wobble'. Thanks.

oh Baffy me too I feel the same and just don't know what I did wrong sorry crying now be back later {{{{hugs}}}}

Baffy, Lily, McD - big hugs to all of you - Baffy, take your time - YOU are the better person in all this, you've shown such committment to him & to your marriage - of course it hurts to let it go. He and OW will do something stupid again and you will then be ready to post that letter. Good advice to keep it in your bag until you are ready.

HW - the forecast is for rain for the weekend - I'll comfort myself by thinking about your turf. I want some sunshine as I head off to Glos, but never mind .

I'll be in London next Tuesday, in case anyone's free to meet. I can get out of town fairly easily, if it's in a northerly direction...

Hey, Baffy, Macdoodle, neither of you did anything wrong. That is, you can no doubt point to things you could have done better, but you're human, you're allowed not to be perfect all the time. It sounds from here as if you did as well as any human being could do, and you can't really expect more of yourselves than that, can you?

I tell you what else (and any proper solicitor should tell you this): sending the papers to the court isn't the last word. If you don't keep pushing this divorce thing along it won't happen, you know. There are lots of stopping points where you can say "no, I don't think I want to do the next bit". There is time built in during which they will encourage you to seek mediation. And ultimately, if you do go all the way to decree absolute, only to find the aliens have decided to return your real husband - well, you could always remarry...

I'm butting in here A LOT, unlike my usual lurk-post-run style, because I've just been through this - not the affair, I don't think anyone would touch the nasty creature, but an H who made himself unbearable and wouldn't go. I picked a reasonably priced solicitor who specialised in family law and it went pretty smoothly, despite me having a nervous breakdown part-way through and being a terrible procrastinator at the best of times. Right now, I assure you, that envelope is only an Awful Warning. And by golly do those blokes deserve one of those.

Baffy - you do what feels right for you. Eventually you will decide to post that letter and we will all be cheering you on.

Annie think Baffy and Mcd need your advice as they both are so scared that doing this is final and if it makes it easier to know that's not the case then that may help them along their path.
You are both amazing , strong and beautiful women and fantastic mothers neither of you deserve this but sadly life doesn't dish things out to them that deserve it.
I hope you can both hold each others hand along with us to get each other through this.
Tannee [thanks] the virtual hugs are always better for me as i am not a rl hugger