bump

Aimsmum sorry coming back to the so late, my computer access has been down for 3 months due to AOL and I have had to change internet provider.

I am really sorry things didn't work out and hope you and your dd are ok.

Thanks all, it is nice to read all the encouragement.

In regards to the comments about me hating him, he has emailed me a few times asking me not to hate him because we couldn't make it work/he wasn't able to just fit in with our lives etc.

To be honest I am angry with him now, I do feel that he could have made more of an effort or tried to be part of our family life more, but he was obviously not in a place where he felt he could do that, so we both have to accept that.

We did speak a bit at the time about some sort of step-family councelling but never took it any further.

I have been doing OK, the nice weather has helped, been getting out and about with DD after school, meeting friends foe dinner and playing in the park.

Mostly everyone knows we have split up now, except my colleagues at work, I know it is a stupid thing to even think about but I hate telling everyone. I know they will all be quite surprised (we are not long back from a great trip to New York etc) and will ask a lot of questions. I also don't want to make a big announcement, so i need to wait for the right opportunity to come up.

I just feel once everyone knows I can start to move on properly, although I know that is stupid!

I think you have done the right thing and trusted your instincts hard as it may seem now. Your daughter will appreciate that when she is older.

Brave Aimsmum

Qx

Hiya, just read your post and really do think you are doing the right thing. Please stop being so hard on yourself.

I'm a stepmum and the reality is that the children have to come first, however hard that might be at times. Your partner's attitude did sound very inflexible and, unless he was willing to consider changing, I'm not sure how you two as a couple could move on. Your child is part and parcel of you and surely any new partner has to accept and your daughter if the relationship is going to work in the long term.

Having said that, it can be very hard being a step parent - would he have considered talking to a family counseller with you about how to make it work? Sorry, probably too belated a thought now.

Hold strong - it sounds like you have done the right thing for your dd, however much it hurts you.

Aims I could hug you for being so strong for your dd!

My mum took the other path, and I have never really forgiven her for putting my stepfather before us dcs. He wasn't a terrible person, but he completely changed the family relationship we had, because he had to be boss.

You did absolutely the right thing. Any partner should want to spend time as a family as much as time with you. It's part of the deal.

It might be hard for your dd now, but she will recover - because she knows she has your love.

Sounds like you are doing very well. Why is he asking you not to hate him, has something else happened?

As for me..
my dd talks about xp all the time. We talk about him, he was a huge part of her life, particularly as she has no contact with her biological father. he was for all intents and purposes her 'dad' iykwim.

She/we have lots of very happy memories. She says she misses him still but not as often.. it depends & varies on environment, moods, triggers etc

I try to encourage the idea that just because we aren't a couple anymore that we are still friends and he reinforces the fact that he still loves her etc when he sees her... it's only ever ad-hoc visits but dd seems happy with that. Always left with a 'see-you soon'.

I find it hard to see them together because they very obviously love each other so much.. I just look at them and feel their pain in an "I did this, I took them away from each other" kind of guilt feeling.

It'll always be hard to not be with someone you feel so much for but it's easy to remember the good bits and the bad bits get all hazy. I often have to remind myself just why we are not together.

That's a shame, sorry to hear it is still so hard for you to see them together Does your DD talk about him much/miss him between visits?

I guess I'll just have to see how things go. Just now it would be too hard, I don't really want to see him. He has emailed me a few times to ask me not to hate him. I have just pretty much asked him not to contact me for a couple of weeks, give us both time to think etc.

I am okish just now, trying to keep busy, do things with DD, see friends and when i don't hear from him I am fine, but if i get a text or email it makes me feel crappy again.

So hopefully if i don't hear from him for a bit, I can start to move on and things will get easier.

Thanks again

I would say nothing wrong with her having bought a souvenier and posted it to him.. could have text him to warn him then asked him to phone and say thanks.

my dd still sees my ex from time to time although like you I also said no to start with as couldn't see how it would work.

I said no as thought he would lose interest when he met someone else. Also expected him to go back to his ex (which he did) and I knew she would hate for him to still see my dd.

Anyway, I digress, he comes to see her semi-regularly now. breaks my heart everytime to see them together, they literally don't let go of each other but is working OK.

Think kids get over things quicker than we expect them to.

How are you?

Thanks MOH.

I told DD yesterday, it was horrible, she was sobbing and saying to phone him and if we both said sorry then we could be friends again and everything would be fine

It actually went a bit worse than I was expecting. She seemed a bit better today, however, i took her to the seaside and we had a nice day just the 2 of us, although she mentioned buying x a souvenir or sending him a picture...then quickly dropped it.

We briefly spoke about him continuing to see her, but couldn't really see how it would work. She will probably see him the odd time over the summer at BBQs and my friends baby's christening.....

DD obviously told her dad, who is now texting me and trying to be nice (genuinely) which is a first ever...so i feel like I am in some sort of parallel universe!!

sorry to hear it was awful

lots of ears and support here..

Have you told your dd yet? have you talked about him keeping in touch with her at all?

Thanks, it went pretty badly, there were other issues too, we just couldn't make it work.

Will name change tomorrow I think. Don't really want him reading everything i might write in the next few days/week. Don't know if he would, but not taking the chance.

A change might be nice!

Aimsmum, I'm really sorry it has come to this. I don't quite understand why it had to end just because it wasn't the right time to move in, especially as every one of you will be heartbroken by the decision. I feel very sad for all of you.

He's coming in a couple of hours for his stuff....feel horrible, but know I have to get it over and done with...

Thanks all, especially MOH, I did feel like a bit of an idiot the other day writing that post, but like you say, no matter how much love there is sometimes things just don't work, and there were a few more issues other than just the parenting.

I'm trying to be a bit more positive about it all. Thinking that maybe for the best and in time I will realise that.

Just been out and had dinner with a friend so that helped, then I have a friend's son's party with DD tomorrow that will go on all day, so I'll be occupied so it will be fine.

Then Sunday will be horrible because he is coming to collect his stuff and giving me back mine, then that will be it.....

But for tonight I am being positive!!

Do you know.. you are feeling exactly what I felt in July last year when I split from my (now) xp. He was not my dd's father but had been around for 3 of her 5 years nad was the closest thing she had to a proper dad.

It was breaking up his and her relationship that made my heartbreak.

Like you I knew he lovd me infininitely but there are somethings that, not matter how much you both love each other, just can't be compromised on. For us it was drugs/lying for you guys it's parenting techniques.

I've no real point to this post other than to tell you that I have been in your position and can so relate to trying to make people understand that you know he loves you and that despite everything/anything he's not a bad person.

I hope things work out for you you do sound very very strong. I'm only just starting to feel like I'm getting my life back together and xp is still on the scene (like you close mutual friends). I still love him and he still loves me but I think we are both resigned to knowing that we just can't make it work (we've tried twice now with a 4yr split and my dd in between)

Who knows what will happen in the future between you and he.

You haven't ruined things, you are taking a stand. You are definately right not to just crumble to his will where your daughter is concerned.

Since all three of you love each other and I don't know the whole story but maybe you will get back together with a new understanding. When coming up to making a commitment there has to be this stage of hammering out the ground rules and it is a make or break time.

good for you. How he behaves towards your dd is non negotiable, well done for making it so.

I think you're very strong.

Best of luck.

just wanted to say

good for you

you are clearly a wonderful mother and great woman, well done you made the right choice

your dd is one lucky lady

just take your time and enjoy your relatioship with your dd

It's not your fault and you haven't ruined anything. Please don't be so hard on yourself. You got to a point where you realised that you and your partner had incompatible ideas about some fundamental parts of your life. You have to take risks or you'd never get involved with anyone.

It's happened to me a few times - that you reach that crunch point. It's why I split up with my last two long term BFs - I wanted kids and they didn't. That was easier because I was on my own so no one else got hurt.

It's harder when you have a child to consider. But now I'm a single mum, I really believe that your child's long term needs must come first. And I know that it's going to hurt her in the short term but you made the right decision for both of you I think.

I know that i will still see him at things (my best friend is married to his and most of the friends we have are friends in common) which in a way makes it quite difficult as most social gatherings, holidays, trips etc we have been on in the past 2 years have been as part of this group.

We spoke about that last night and agreed that neither of us wanted the other to start being left out of things (to be honest, it would be more him left out than me) but that makes it quite awkward, for us in the begining and for everyone else really too.

Next event will be my friends 30th at the end of May, so a few weeks yet!

But DD will see him rarely I would think, and that will be hard for her and that is my fault.

I am almost more upset for her than I am for me, cos I caused it, brought someone into her life, encouraged a relationship, then ruined it!

I'm so dreading telling her.

But thanks all for being nice, it's made me cry a bit (again!)

I think you're really brave. I hope you look back on this time in a few years and know you made the right decision.

Oh darling girl.

Oh gosh it must be so hard for you.

Maybe seeing him once in a while might be Ok?

I have a good male friend we see from time to time and ds loves him, he loves ds...never been to bed together, considering it
but need something like 110% commitment to my children now before I get involved...learned the hard way

I am far less canny than you
You and dd have your foundationd intact, which cannot be said for many families. You really are a good mummy xxx

His crying wasn't manipulative, he was genuinely upset that things didn't work out.

I think putting "loved" is a little harsh, he does/did love me, I don't doubt that for a minute. It's hard to really know what a relationship was lie from just a snapshot in an OP but we really did have a lot of great times and there was a lot of love in our relationship.

But I will go on the holiday with DD alone, I have been on holidays alone in the past with her and haven't been bothered by it. We will both still have a good time.

Thanks NM, I don't feel like I have handled it well.

I feel like I have ruined things for DD too, she loves DP and explaining to her that she wont see him again will be so hard and she will be devastated. She shouldn't have to go through that upset and it is my fault for involving her.

I feel like a shit parent rather than a good one at the moment

I had a nice boyfriend when Ds1 was small - not exactly a boyfriend, but a man I hung out with a bit and quite fancied.
I was pregnant with my second and he came over one evening.
He was sweet and I liked talking to him, he was very shy also I think - never had a long term girlfriend and clearly fancied me, as I did him.
We watched TV and Ds1 wouldn't go to sleep...man went out to buy something for supper, but before he went he made some daft comment about my son - something probably tongue in cheek, but I had a moment when I thought he meant it - something disparaging about kids.
Anyway as he was leaving he asked if he should bring anything for me when he came back, and we just looked at each other and knew he wasn't coming back, because he knew and I knew that I needed someone who understood and loved my children.
Lovely guy but there you go.
I think it would have been a disaster to go out with him.
Hope you feel better soon Aimsmum - I'd echo the person who said you are a great mum, very impressed how you have handled this. Dd is lucky to have a strong mother x

I was in your position 10 years ago.

I decided that my son would never welcome anyone into our life and I didn't want him to have even an unspoken responsibility for me having no partner. I suppose I didn't think I could do any better and that there was no such thing as a perfect marriage.
I hoped that the relationship would improve because sometimes they were fine but always competing for my attention I suppose.

Anyway perhaps selfishly I did marry my partner and have had 3 more children.

Sometimes we still row about my son. My dh has supported him all these years but never loved him as he does his own children or as I wish he could have.
My first son loves and adores his little brothers and sister and he wants me to be happy and dh is the guy he loves to hate.

Things have never been perfect and sometimes I wonder did I do the right thing. When I see stepdads who appear to love their stepchildren I wonder is it real and if so I am very jealous.

I think this break up is a good and brave thing for you to do. Your (x)partner may realise how important this is and change his attitude. Or you may go on and meet someone who is better with kids. I wish you all the best whatever happens.

Ainsmum,

Re your comments:-

"He was really crying when he left, saying he would still do things with DD etc and that he loves us, but I don't think that would be wise".

I think you are right in that all contact should now cease as you're no longer together. BTW his crying can also actually be seen as manipulative. Think he "loved" you more than your daughter and did not accept you both fully; he only wanted what ultiamtely suited him (which is to have your daughter packed off to her room when it was "incovenient" for him to have her around. I therefore do not think for one minute he would have made either a kind or good stepfather to her.

You did the right thing. Not all women in your situation would have ended it and the underlying issues with communicating effectively with one another would have continued to fester.

"We have a holiday booked for the summer and everything"

Take his name off the holiday booking and have a nice time with your daughter. Its not too late to change the booking although they will likely charge you to make a change.

Thanks both.

Dont feel that great or fantastic at the moment! But I guess it will take a few days for things to sink in and get my head around everything.

you sound like a bloody fantastic mum, and a great woman. you will meet the man who deserves you when the time is right.

Don't think you portrayed him as a bad person. I think you have described both of you as being very sensible about the whole situation.

It has been a really hard decision for the both of you, but it sounds like you have both put your daughter first.

Thanks all.

Can't help feeling that I have portrayed him as a bad person when he's not.

He was really crying when he left, saying he would still do things with DD etc and that he loves us, but I don't think that would be wise.

We have both made a hard decision, we just now have to live with it.

We have a holiday booked for the summer and everything

As someone who had a Stepfather who was always jealous of any time or attention that by mother gave me, and who made me a very insecure person because of this type of devisive thinking, can i just say that I think you are wonderful for taking the harder but undoubtedly better path for your daughter.

She may never ever realise what you have just done for her, because she won't have the negative times and the feeling of being pushed aside to look back on. (Just the lovely happy security of knowing that she quite rightly comes first.) She is very lucky to have a Mum like you.

Sorry to hear that Aims. Hope you feel happier again soon.

how sad for ypou all..good luck with things in the future

sorry to hear the news, Aims. wishing you the best.

I'm sorry
You sound very strong to have reached this decision despite your deep feelings for him.

Three cheers to you though for putting your daughter first. Many of us don't see through the haze of attraction to the pragmatics of relationships and there are a lot of men who don't find it easy being around children.

Kind of makes me despair when even the nice ones like yours, are uncertain when it comes to children!

I hope you will be happy after the hurt subsides x

My OP was written in anger really, he isn't a bad person, but we obviously clash on things that are important.

He does love me, I don't doubt that, and we could communicate well, we just couldn't get over the issues we had. And I was part of the problem as much as he was.

But I could go over it and over it and I don't know if there is any point in doing that.

I just have to deal with what has happened and try to move on the best i can.

Oh I'm sorry to hear that. Sounds like it is the right decision in the long term.

I can imagine it will hard telling dd. I think you're wise to wait a few days, wait till you've got your head around it.

I hope you feel better soon.

"He really is a genuinely nice person, just with unusual, and unacceptable ideas about children"

Some nice role model/stepfather for your daughter he would have been - NOT. I think you've both had a lucky escape frankly. He would have become more ghastly to your daughter over time.

I actually think you love him far more than he loved you. He "loved" you but only wanted you for himself and he may well never have fully accepted your daughter's rightful place in her own home.

On a wider level too this relationship did not seem completely sound to start with if there were lots of disagreements and niggles; those also cite problems with communicating with each other effectively.

Better to be alone than to be badly accompanied.

Really sorry to hear that, Aimsmum. Hope things work out well for you in the future.

We decided we couldn't make it work, not only over the DD issue, but over lots of wee things that all just build up.

Am really, really gutted, feel horrible, because i love him and know he loves me, but we just can't really make it work!

Am so worried about telling DD because she will be really upset, will wait a few days!

Sometimes things are so shit!

Thanks AimsMum, I hope the hypnotherapy does help

I think that it will take some adjustment for your dd to become accustomed to a new family set up and if you decide to make any changes, they need to be gradual as your dd will be feeling vulnerable at this time and will need to feel included.

Let's hope after your chat tonight he does appreciate that! Fingers crossed. Let us know how it went!

If it were me I would tell him if he doesn't like your DD playing, singing, dancing etc in HER OWN HOME, he's quite welcome to go and play in his/your bedroom !!

Selfish in the extreme I'm afraid. I would be seriously reconsidering the relationship if he wasn't mature enough to appreciate that HE is moving on on your DDs territory and that HE is the one who has to make the adjustments/compromises, at least at first, to ensure DD is accepting of him NOT the other way around.

Glad to hear it

If he was like mine you'd have been miles away by now, you sound very sensible!!

No he is nothing like Flight's X at all!

He has never, and never would say anything like that about DD, he doesn't even think bad stuff about her.

He really is a genuinely nice person, just with unusual, and unacceptable ideas about children!

Flight! If my boyf ever said anything like that, he would be kicked to the kerb too! I don't think Aimsmum's dp is as bad as that...

Colditz puts it well - though about "childless people often have disgusting ideas"!

I think you do have to be saying "This is the way it is, accept it or go," if you listen to his pov and decide it really will be impossible for you & your dd to live with.
I have had to say that to my boyf before, not that he has ever tried to change the way I do things, rather when he has gone through moments of doubting wtf he was doing with me.

Thanks all, I know, I have lots to think about. I know he has been thinking a lot over the past few days as weel, so I can't really second guess what he will say later.

I know that i will never compromise over DD or her feelings, so I will see what he is now thinking about the situation and what I have said and see how we will (if we can) move on from there.

This is ONLY my opinion and I am probably alot older than you lot! So perhaps I see your dp point-of -view a little. I was a single parent of my DS,he was 6 when I met my DP(husband to be)He hadn't had a serious relationship for a good while,and hadn't been a parent.We valued our time together as a couple,and he wanted to be a "dad" to my son.It was a hard transition for him,it is important to put the wishes of your child first,I agree,but also you need "couple" time,as many relationships fail,as Mums become so involved with their children,that the couple end up with nothing in common.He is telling you that he values your "special" time,and everyone has to adjust to new routines when he moves in.If you try to discuss this reasonably,and don't dig your heels in I'm sure he will adjust his views about the child playing in their room.While you go head to head,each of you will make ultimatums and no "compromise" will be reached.Living together is Give and take.My (now) husband and our do clash over parenting issues,but discuss them out and reach a compromise which we are both happy with,usually.We have agood marriage and have 2 more children together and he has "learnt" to be an excellent father,to ALL our children.If you love this guy and YOUR child does,you can all adjust together with a flexible attitude to the changes.Good Luck!

Smug, I couldn't agree more.

Moving in together means two things, separately.

he means "Live with my girlfriend"

you mean "Live as a family"

I think you have crossed wires.

It's not unusual for a childless man to be completely unrealistic about what living with a chil entails. He needs a trial run. He also needs fair warning about what you will and will not do.

I would, for example, be extremely clear about how you will NOT be permanently available to massage his ego and happily follow his every whim, just because he lives with you. You are already available, and (sorry but this is just parenting) already living with the whims of someone much more important. You cannot be the adoring and readily available partner he wants ... so he either has to adjust his expectations of what life in your family entails, or not move in.

Expecting a little girl to be shunted off to a side room like an annoying dog is disgusting ... but then, childless people often have disgusting ideas.

Actually it was 'kid's a pain in the arse (sometimes)' which isn't really any better. (Why say it at all if he didn't want me to say' sure, I'll have him adopted so we can be together')

Plus after I left/we broke up (still not sure who left) he had the nerve to ring me saying he 'missed Ds' and asking to talk to him!
Asking to get back together because he missed the child he had so thoroughly resented and competed with during the relationship takes the piss.

again, your bloke is probably not this bad but you get my drift

If you're arguing and things aren't happy - then you are not ready to take the next step to move in together. Moving in won't fix the things that are wrong and will only make things worse.

Sorry but have read OP again and I am still with Yurt. He has no concept of integrating as a family and wants to divide and rule.
Sorry Aimsmum.
Basically he wants to be the most important person in your life. He never will be.
Stay friends by all means, he sounds nice in other ways, but what he is demanding/suggesting now can be taken as a portent of things to come - almost a warning.

I can barely believe he has the gall to even mention something like this.
I can only think that perhaps he is afraid it will NOT be the way he wants it to be, and is trying either to get you to say , Oh well we;'d better not live together then' so he is off the hook, or else to 'warn' you that he will expect to be top of the tree and no less, so if he ever complains about DD, he will be able to say 'well I did say before I moved in' bla bla.

Quite possibly he knows deep down he can't cope with being a parent full time and will be relieved if you say no.

To my mind he evidently can't cope with it as if he was the right bloke for the job, he would be loving the prospect of being in a family with you and your child.

My ex was another who really didn't want more kids - I thought naively that I could have a boyfriend for me, and he wouldn't have to be a dad to my child, but it was impossible.

One example text from him:
'Here's honesty: Kid's a pain in the arse, but you are so the one'

Run, run, run.

o god we have been together nearly 10 years and still we have the battle of my kids and his kids, it is so very hard

I think he seems like a nice bloke who is making lots of effort - and is being practical with thinking through issues before they occur. It;s obviously a big adjustment for all three of you - and you'll all have wobbles on he way - but I don't see why people are being so negative about the long term prospects of your relationship.

It sounds like you all appreciate each others contribution to the family and have created a structure where everyone's needs are considered. To me that seems like a strong base to work through any teething issues,

By the standards of some of the other posters on this thread, a lot of men who grew into being fantastic fathers should have been disqualified at the first hurdle.

Good luck with it tomorrow night

I think it's great that this has all come out, like i said, it's an opportunity to talk it all through, rather than not have talked it through & find out what he thinks before it's too late.

He spend 1 or 2 night and the weekend here. DD is here for some of that, in the evening, when he comes in, and he deals with noise (of which there isn't a great deal) fine, he never really comments on it and they will chat.

At the weekend it varies, as I said she goes to her dad's every second Saturday evening to stay, and he has football on one of the afternoons. But again he doesn't really complain or anything, just doesn't overly get involved at time, I suppose. But other times does, it very much varies.

I agree we do really need to talk it all through.

PG that sounds horrible for you, I hope the hypnotherapy helps.

Please do not allow him to impose these rules on your dd. When I was a little girl, I was told to be quiet and not make noise because my step dad didn't like it. I was very unhappy and used to pretend to be invisible when I was downstairs so he didn't notice me I am having hypnotherapy to get over the incredible damage it did to my confidence.

How much time does he spend with you when she's there, and how does he react to the noise, etc that he's talked about changing?

Boyf & I don't actually get any daytime to ourselves unless I arrange friend or family to babysit. He has a very full life, can only be over usually about 3 nights a week inc weekends.

"it would be a big change for me to also have someone else coming into things and having to share parenting and responsibility, which is something I have never ever had to do before."

I can really relate to that, and that's one of the main reasons I'm not ready yet either. Even if boyf & I ever do feel ready, I'm sure there will be rocky times at first.

I think, you don't need to panic yet. Try talking it all through, you never know, if you spell things out to him he might come round & see what you mean, or at least accept that you have the final say, and that you need to wait. Nothing wrong with explaining why you were really hurt & upset about what he said about your dd too, hopefully even though he's not a parent he will have some empathy and be able to understand a bit.

No, there is no rush, and I now don't think we are, I just feel as though all this has changed things.

Maybe I am expecting too much, I don't know....

I'm sure you'll do what is best for her this time too xx

i do think nonimous brings up a very salient point in that maybe you're not ready to move in.

there's no rush, after all.

I have spent her whole life standing up for her!! I wouldn't stop now

I don't think he is jealous of her, I really don't, but obviously there are problems.

Loads of posts, I'll try to answer as much as I can.

Kif in reply to your second post, you are possibly right about the bond I have with DD and our relationship. However there is plent of time for us to discuss adult issues, every evening, every sunday afternoon and every second saturday night when DD is with her dad.

Your idea about having a meeting and a chat is a good one, DD can express herself well and would be totally responsive to that. Although I know she would say that she would want DP to be more involved in our lives. Just last week she asked him if they could go swimming just the 2 of them, which they did and tonight she was disappointed that he wasn't coming up.

He does show affection and is caring towards her or the relationship wouldn't have progressed this far. I just thing he needs to maybe grow up a bit, see things from her point of view and realise that I am a parent and to be with me means he needs to take that on board.

But he has made an effort and they do get on well, but a lot of the time, rightly ot wrongly, I do feel torn, but that possibly comes from just being used to having DD on my own, it would be a big change for me to also have someone else coming into things and having to share parenting and responsibility, which is something I have never ever had to do before.

But yes, I think the reality is very different to the ideal you have in mind before children, i suppose.

Aimsmum, I am so sorry but having red your OP, he has to go.

Really.
Anyone who is this jealous of your child has no place in your (and her) home.

I would be furious.
It would be such a betrayal of her to allow him to take precedence over her already established and good relationship with her mother

My ex said this too, 'he runs you ragged, he can't be allowed to be in charge' etc etc. My son was 3

So sorry. It's awful but I think from the fat you're posting this and talking to him about the doubt you have shows that you know already.

Stand up for DD - no one else will.
xx

Foxy: "The reality is really quite different! It takes time and experience to realise this. You have the experience, and I really think he needs to take your lead with all things parenting until their relationship has 'bedded in'."

YES!!

I've just read expat's post and it's reminded me of how different your situation is to mine - boyf has been around since I was pg, so his relationship to dd is very very different from that of a new father figure coming into her life. so yes, there needs to be a hell of a lot more sensitivity towards your dd than your boyf is giving credit to.

But I still don't think it's necessarily the end of the relationship, there's still opportunity to talk it all through hypothetically.

It is so important that he is positive towards her, both of us have always been acutely aware of how important it is that he's not just my partner, because as someone else said, when you're a single parent with an only child, it is very much a partnership (with your child i mean) & a boyfriend can feel like a wedge in the middle - or in fact dd can feel like a wedge in the middle. (Though most of the time I've felt like the wedge! ) <<lightbulb moment: they say three's a crowd!>>

Btw re getting in from work & stuff -my boyf wants to spend that time with dd, however tired he is. He usually reads the bedtime story too. In fact, at bedtime it's me who's the one impatiently trying to get dd off to bed! I actually had to have a word with him once when he reacted to my grumpiness to her bedtime being delayed, to spell out what it was like to be with her all day every day, bedtime was the hardest time of the day for me, whereas he was up for lovely cosy threesome time (aww, i was a meanie!) - funnily enough, later on, one day when he was with dd all day when my child care fell through, when i got in from work he said "Is it ok if i go in the bedroom for a while? i need a bit of me-time!"

Before we become parents don't we all have our ideas of how we will/won't do it? We won't bribe them with sweets, we won't shout at them in the supermarker, we will see them as individuals etc etc

The reality is really quite different! It takes time and experience to realise this. You have the experience, and I really think he needs to take your lead with all things parenting until their relationship has 'bedded in'.

Good luck with whatever you do

I haven't read the other replies but my knee jerk response is this....
Your dd was around before your bf and her needs and feelings come first. You're right sending her to her room to have adult time when her bedtime is 7.30 (adult time all night) is ridiculous and sounds like your bf is jealous of the relationship you have with your dd. I can only see this getting worse when he moves in. It really isn't any of his business, unless your dd is really dreadful, to say that she rules the roost as this questions your parenting and he has no experience or in any postion to judge.
I would wonder if you ever had a child together whether he would have the same rules or would then push your dd out completely.
I think you need to let this one go, really sorry. Asking MN it seems that you know that already and just need a little encouragement or validation. Good Luck.

i don;t think your dd is an equal se is a child you and your patner will be the parents this relationship is not equal - is a dicatorship - as nicely as you want - using whatever methods you see fot - you ge your child to do what to believe your child shoudl do at any given point.

your dd should feel comfortable in her own home - singing dancing laughing playing are all acceptable in any area of the house - the more the better.

you must sit down and decide what your partner can and cannot parent.

you must realise that you will be being faught over.

partner will want to be dominant male and might do some shitty stuff to prove this.

you need to tell daughter that partner now had right to tell her to d things

tel partner she is 7 years old and to give a bit of slack.

tell your partner that you will do whatever is fair and you will let things go - but at the end of the day your daughter wil always be loved more - thats how mums work married or not natural children or not

Sorry, I can see his point a little bit and I think he's being quite honest bringing it up before you live together rather than after. How about a compromise ? Some people do need some time to adjust when they come home from work, it doesn't mean they don't like children. How about you playing with her in her room for about the first half hour when he comes in, both of you together, a kind of girlie time, then ask him to become more involved after about 7.15 in bed-time, story reading etc. I'm sure there are ways around these things because apart from that you seem really happy with him.

It doesn't sound as though you are ready to move in together tbh, but it doesn't mean you won't be one day. Me & my boyf have been together for nearly 5 1/2 years, since I was pg, and we're not ready yet! Though mainly for practical reasons now (financial, and we both have ambitions that would be scuppered if we lived together).

The way we see it is, we have to be ready to be a family and a parenting team, he has to be ready to be a father - not just to be ready to move in together as a couple, which we were ages ago, and which it sounds like is the way your boyf is viewing it as.

I think you should be able to slot in nicely, naturally , and just carry on the way you already are other than his added responsibility for the household of course. e.g. I wouldn't change much about the time the three of us spend together, it's a nice mix of giving each other breaks and the three of us hanging out. Boyf loves hanging out with dd too. And boyf does his fair share of housework related to our time together iykwim - tidying, washing up, etc (i'm working on the cooking bit.......)

Also, although we talk through parental/discipline issues etc, he respects that I always have the last word, and he follows my lead in it. He says he has learnt tons and hopes that he will behave similarly to his own child if we ever have one to how he behaves with dd.

Plus, we are very clear about what WILL change (particularly for my boyf) because we've had the opportunity to talk it all through hypothetically, and test bits out when he is here, which a lot of couples don't have, or if they do talk about it, the reality of children is very different from what either of them expected!

Rather than finding it all out when it's too late... oh it's great to be a single mum!
Perhaps you are at the stage where those hypothetical discussions can be thrashed out, rather than making them a reality yet?

We only have 1 or 2 friends between us who have kids, and we both find it frustrating that our friends just Don't Get It. It's funny because my (childless) girl friends tend to find it hard to understand why we can't just move in together, we're that steady & solid & long term etc, whereas my male friends - and his too, who initially thought he was a complete idiot for sticking by me - are just in awe of what he has come through. I myself CANNOT IMAGINE how hard it must have been and am also in awe.

It feels like we're "in it" together now, living our relationship in our own unique way that most people, parents & non-parents, don't really understand. 3 years ago, where you're at now, it didn't feel like that so much, i felt very alone and like he didn't understand. As time has gone by, he has understood and accepted it more. (well, me too actually come to think of it, it's been a huge learning curve for both of us, we've both had a hell of a lot of growing up to do!)

We both know there's a future waiting for us as a family, but for now, we've got our own individual lives and ambitions to work through, and a little more growing up to do too before we're ready (that's boyf, that is!).

I just thought, i suppose it depends on how old you are too and how ready you are. I myself am definitely not ready to move in with boyf. If I was I suppose I would be getting impatient and see him as being the one who needs to make a decision either way. How do you feel? (I'm sorry I'm sure you've said already I will read back, I've taken so long to write this post...)

Have only read the OP but I don't understand why you're with him, let alone thinking of moving in with him. I have a ds from my first marriage and wouldn't be with dh#2 now had he not shown affection and care and agreement on parenting towards ds.

TBH, I think I would split up with him.

Certainly under NO circumstances would I move in with him unless his attitude changed.

But he doesn't get it and never will because he doesn't have kids.

And, seeing it from the viewpoint of a 7-year-old girl who has been on her own with her Mummy for 4 years now and whose biological dad was in and out, I'd be inclined to tell him to take a hike.

The whole 'adult time' would do it for me.

Why? Because when you become involved with someone who has kids they are a package deal. There IS no separating them for their kids, that's unfair and wrong and the major reason why I never went out with men who had kids back when I was single and childfree - I was able to admit I was too selfish to take that one and it wasn't good for the kids, not their fault I felt like that.

Thanks all, lots to think about.

Fimbo, yes we definitely could carry on the way we are until DD is older, and he maybe gets more of an idea what parenting entails, but i feel now the whole thing has been brough up, I can't just push it aside and feel we have to deal with it, if you see what I mean.

I do think a lot of it is him just not understanding what parenting ivolves and me being so touchy it is hard to talk about it.

Kif, DD is in her own room from 7.30 every night (except at the weekend when it is later, but then every second Saturday night through to sunday night she stays with her dad) so i do think there is plenty of adult time.

Not sure why I'm being 'd, I do want her to be thought of as an equal, in any new living situation her feelings should be valid and I think as a child going through a period of change she should be thought of more, rather than less.

I don't know how to put this without it coming off wrong, but my experience with single parent families that I know (esp with eldest girl) is that the parent and the eldest/only child form more of a 'partnership' than parents and eldest children of two parent families. Your DP - rightly - expects to come into your family as your partner (rather than a lodger or older brother), so that inevitably means renegotiating Dds position to an extent.

I think defending time and space for good communication is important for any couple - especially when things are new. If your Dd is always around, when will you have time to talk through any issues that might be coming up between you and your Dp?

My suggestion would be to have a three way meeting somewhere neutral (like a family pub dinner) where your Dd and your Dp can negotiate a mutually acceptable solution. i think a 7 year old, given a bit of space, can be impressively articulate and consistent. Certainly I think negotiation is better than having a black and white view of 'Dd is vulnerable Dp is selfish'. So, your Dd might be happy to agree to play in her room from 7.30 pm, but might really like him to stop - say - raising his voice, or grumbling about singing.

the thing that made me think is "I want my DD to be thought as of an equal" children are not equal to adults. Their needs are equally as important though. I know my ex treated his dd almost equal like and the family therapist said he need to address it as it was unhealthy for her to feel she was equal.

Hmmm.

On the one hand, new person moving into the family obviously has to be handled sensitively, so Dd doesn't feel like she's been sidelined in favour of 'new person'.

But - as someone who isn't a single parent - I find it essential that the kids bugger off in the evenings, so dh and I have a bit of time being a couple, not a parenting team. My eldest is 4. I insist on own rooms after 7, even if I can hear Dd is reading or listening to music or playing.

DH is a fantastic hand-on Dad. However, I find he's best at being 100% focused at some times and then vegetating 100% at other times.

Just thought i'd add.. i'm coming to you as a stepmum to a child who was 8 when i moved in with her father.

If this is the only issue, and you think its just because he doesn't really understand what parenting is really about, don't give up on him yet.

People always jump to quickly on the "leave him" bandwagon around here.

Have him move in with you for a few weeks and see if you can come to some kind of compromise that works for all of you. Maybe agree that she had 30 minutes quiet time in her room before her bedtime?

While he can't expect to get everything regarding your DD his way, equally, its unfair of you to think everything should carry on the same and he just slot into how you and DD live.

I honestly think he just doesn't have a clue about living full time with a child, rather than any nastiness.
I would invite him to live full time in your home for 1 month, under YOUR rules to let him see what it is really like, without a break and without a night back at his own place.
He may realise himself how far off the mark he is on this. Good luck.

Could you carry on as you are until dd's a bit older?

I need to go now, good luck for tomorrow.

<<positive vibes>>

In regards to the month thing, he seemed ok with that, but did say that he would be worried that after the month, if either one of us thought that things hadn't worked out for whatever reason, what that would mean for our relationship.

Whether we could take that step backwards again and for things to still be ok between us.

I would be quite happy to leave the moving in thing for a while, as i said in my OP, but it has been through talking about that, that i have realised his views, and if i don't think they will change, then at what point do you decide enough is enough and things can't move forward because the issues are still there, they have just been swept aside for a bit.

Fimbo, yes, I do really love him, up until all this i could 100% imagine me having more children and spending the rest of my life with him. He has been good for me, I have changed a lot in the past 2 years and he has supported me through a lot of stuff too. But there have been problems too, but nothing we haven't been able to work through. I just feel this is a biggy. But I definitely do love him and I know that he loves me.

Cargirl, that is a good point, and my DD does perhaps have more say/sway than a normal 7 year old, but i'm not sure, weirdly her 2 best friends are also from a single parent family so can't really guage from them, and the other totally bosses her parents about, so DD is nothing like her....

When dh and I got together we didn't want any children, we looked after his nephews on a few occasions and were put off for life.

Feelings change. My dh loves being a parent something he wouldn't have said all those years ago.

Sorry I am waffling now.

Aimsmum: sure, and I think that they're probably the right things to think about. Even gu