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Mumsnet Discussions:
Education
: Do you feel you are *entitled* to the "best" school for your children?
(486 messages)
Does this apply also to people in different social classes?
i.e if you're entitled to the "best" school why isn't everyone else?
Is there a middle-class sense of "entitlement" to the "best schools" in this country? Is the problem that we have such a variation in standards of schools across a supposedly comprehensive system? Is it people playing the system, moving out of catchment, "getting faith" etc, and making themselves part of the problem and not part of the solution? Or is the issue simply one of being too obsessed by the schools that do well in the league tables and/or have a nice uniform?
(It's a quiet Saturday... Walks away whistling, hands in pockets... Gas Mark 6, set to simmer. I'll be back...)
I think its over-obsessiveness. And all schools should be the same. Its the sense of entitlement that allows someone to say they want a school without any 'disabled' children in that makes me go all cross. But this obsessiveness seems to be getting out of hand - moving house, lying, going to church - which then puts too much pressure on those poor kids. How does a child feel knowing the parents spent thousands moving house for a certain school? How do they then feel if they get a B instead of an A star?
Well legally you're not- you're entitled to a 'suitable' education, not the best.
A good school should be able to meet the needs of a wide school community.
But I don't really see academic results as the most important part of school (I want my children to do as well as they can but I'm more interested in them being happy). I think I see education as important though (which is different from exam results).
Who said anything about being handed anything on a plate?
I fail to see how this links with my initial questions (all connected with the fairness or otherwise of the state system) and a snide, sneering, know-all, glib comment (assuming it wasn't a joke) which totally fails to take account of the complexities of people's lives??
A truer statement I've not read in a long time on this board, ST.
I would consider I'd failed my children if I did not teach them that you are entitled to big fat FA in life, or if they learned as little personal responsiblity as I see on some of these boards.
It takes an awful lot on here for me to feel I have to respond in such a way. People will know that. I will debate serious points which I disagree with. I will NOT debate glib nur-nur-hee-nur-nur asides.
Whoops! That's what I get spending the day IRL actually meeting the folks around us, just killing time till tea's out of the slow cooker before the emergency meeting in the village hall tonight.
Yeah, Expat. Maybe it's my American side, but I really don't feel entitled to much. If I get something that is unexpected, then I think of it as a bonus. If I am disatisfied with what is handed on a plate, I will not cry about it - I will go for it myself (as long as legal etc.)
I don't cry that I have grey hair, or expect the NHS to fix it for me - I pay to get it dyed myself.
Science Teacher it was the "stop whinging, go private" comment that annoyed me. That option is not viable for most people and to follow it up with "study engineering at university and get a good job" is completely patronising.
you don't always make your own life complex. I had an unexpected brain damaged child. So DH had to give up work. So we couldn't take responsibility for things that cost money cos we couldn't earn it.
Could always go homeschool, apply for bursaries, take out loans or get other jobs to pay for private, sell up and downsize to move house, train for a new job at night or at OU to make more money.
I know it's not easy. But it's really as complex as you make it with the exception of a scarce few things.
I guess I've grown tired of taking the path of most resistance myself and I'm old beyond my years - and ALL of it my own fault.
My ds went to a lovely small local primary school. Times top 100, great Ofsted report .... Most of the kids there do really well.. Just not him! Yep, this great school was not right for him. Should I have left him there getting a worse education than his class mates? Not all children are the same and not all schools are the same! It's up to each parent to do the 'best' they can for their child. Who else will?
That was the decision we made in our own personal circumstances, Pablov. A decision that we were able to make because we worked our way up to it via education and hard work up the greasy pole.
We worked 17 years before paying our first set of school fees, btw.
well my dh studied engineering has a Ba Hons and is half way through an Msc. He works in a managerial position within a multi national company that is supported by the government and we cant afford to shop at tesco let alone send our children private. So piss off scienceteacher
k, you can't work, riven. but it's not all 100% about work or even money.
sorry, i'm not making much sense.
but i'll step out on a limb here and get flamed for a moment because it's just my small observation that for some reason quite a few folk here tend to be quite hopeless and of the throw-up-your-hands variety.
and if that offends again i apologise as it wasn't my intention.
but there is ALWAYS something to do. even in the worst of situations. if you keep your wits about you.
k, you can't work, riven. but it's not all 100% about work or even money.
sorry, i'm not making much sense.
but i'll step out on a limb here and get flamed for a moment because it's just my small observation that for some reason quite a few folk here tend to be quite hopeless and of the throw-up-your-hands variety.
and if that offends again i apologise as it wasn't my intention.
but there is ALWAYS something to do. even in the worst of situations. if you keep your wits about you.
Scienceteacher. Private does not necessarily mean best. I was employed at a private school with no previous teaching experience. I was not given a police check nor were my references followed up. I could have been anyone, but they were desperate at the time and so took me on.
Having a degree does not mean that you are automatically entitled to a well-paid job either. Depends on the degree. If everyone simply got an Engineering degree then there would be too many engineers!
Your "solutions" are too simplified and I don't think you have taken into account the complexities of life.
This is a capitalist society and we need manual workers to ensure a stable economy. Therefore we need people to go into factories and make clothes, we need cleaners to ensure those factories are clean, we need construction workers etc etc. These people hold together the very fabric of society yet are denied the many luxuries that their efforts, in part, pay for. So whilst the boss of the factory can pay for his children to go to a private school on the back of his profits, due to his workers hard work, those workers have to make do with the state school.
So dear, I really do think you need to intellectualise your debates somewhat if you want to be taken seriously and not have insults hurled at you.
So, Riven, we should all down tools out of compassion for those who have been struck down?
What will that do for the country, and how will that help us to support those who are unable to support themselves (ie those who have been struck down)?
I am very convicted that we should make the most of our gifts, and not to be swayed by the negative aspects of political correctness.
I think we are all entitled to expect our local schools to be decent. As they were, it appeared to me, when I was a child. My family moved around a lot and my sister and I just went to whatever the local school was - and they were fine. It wasn't as polarised as it seems to be now, these were just the neighbourhood schools that every child went to. OK, we never lived on sink estates, but no-one had to fight to get into my CofE junior school, it was just the local school with a mixed intake.
Seems very different now. Dh and I moved house and pay a heck of a premium to live in a commuter town with good schools.
Mind you, the lovely little village school I went to for the first few years had outside loos, the headmaster didn't know about the two brains of the diplodocus (now disproved anyway, I hear) and my reception teacher had a nervous breakdown...
I certainly think that my children are entitled to the "best" education. I was lucky enough to go to one of the best comprehensives in Britain. Funnily enough all the comprehensives in the area were good to excellent. Even funnier was the complete lack of public and private schools within a 2 hour drive.
So, having come from one of those very rare areas where the best students and teachers are not "skimmed off" by private education, I am convinced by the potential of comprehensive education.
I think one of my current issues with schooling is the lack of responsibility taken by children for their own education. Those who get on and do well (in any school) will be those who work the hardest for their grades. I am utterly sick of hearing "Miss I can't believe I failed my test.", "Well, did you revise?", "No." "Argh!"
Hmm, have rambled about nothing in particular for long enough, and I'm sure I haven't answered any of the OP's questions, really. So rant around me if you could
yer what? You don't have to 'down tools' but you can stop sneering at those who cannot take responsibility through no fault of their own or thinking of them as 'losers'. But there seems to be an attitude that if one isn't earning scads of money one is a failure and hasn't tried hard enough. You can do you very best but still not afford a private school. This doesn't mean your kids aren't entitled to a decent state education. Doing your best isn't equal for evreyone.
Tis a shame that what could have been the start of a reasonable debate was rather destroyed by the ridiculous comments by ST. Clearly 'going private' isn't an option for most people, so it's not realistically contributing to the debate. If the debate doesn't interest you, then look at another thread. Why be ridiculous ? To reply to UQD's OP. I don't think I'm entitled to "the best" but I do think I, and everyone else with children is entitled to a "satisfactory" school. I could not have sent my children to the catchment area school where we used to live. This isn't to do with exam results, this is to do with the state of the school and the low expectaions of the present cohort. It is a really complex question as to how it got like that, but once a school gets a bad reputation then it does quickly slide downhill very fast as people who care about their children being safe and happy move out of the area as fast as they can sell. Is that right ? In theory, no, but in practice, I'm not putting my children through that for any high principal of mine. I think problems with poor schools became so widespread when Tony Blair et al started promising people they could 'choose'. Before that people did generally go to their local school - everbody did, and there was usually enough of a mix for the kids who wanted to work to find enough other people the same as them, and those that didn't to find their own buddis all within the same school, but then people were told they had the right to choose when clearly there was, in reality very little choice - hence big disappointment for loads of parents each year.
And funny how "hard work" seems to now relate only to the middle class. Factory workers who work shifts for £6ph will never be able to afford the fees that Private Schools demand, yet no-one could ever accuse them of not working hard.
To simply say that if you worked harder you would make more money is false. And not exactly an intelligent comment to make. If that statement were true then the economy would collapse. We need people to work very hard for the bare minimum to keep the economy stable, maintain levels of lending and so on.
eh Expat? I do take responsibility for my child. I care for her 24 hours a day. This means I cant work. I feel like I have taken responsibility but others do not. And I fight daily for the 'best' for her. But one day I'll be dead and she will be unable to 'fight' even if she does her best. But I still think she's entitled to a decent life.
If people want me to take scienceteacher's jibe seriously then I will. And it was a jibe, not a point, which was why I responded in the way I did.
It has the underlying assumption that there is an integral relationship between what you choose to study and the financial rewards for this - and assumes a great degree of planning and predictability in people's lives (not saying this is what happened to me, but what if you worked hard, had 50K in an ISA then found you needed it for an emergency operation? or to get emergency repairs done on the house? or you divorce/separate?)...
The whole idea that if you want to send your children to a "good" school than all you need to do is get a "good" degree followed by a "good" job with "good" money is rather startlingly simplistic.
I have not read the whole thread but riven is disabled herself and has a profoundly disabled child and I know its not a competition but it does make your options in life pretty limited
Ds1 goes to our local school even though it has a large socio econimc mix and ethnic (travellers in this case) mix. The headteacher is well respected and runs the very large school well. It isnt the best school in the area though but ds1 is happy (more important imo) I would send him to any school he would be happy in tbh> Childhood is about more then your academic acheivment
picking up on someone earlier point...I was brought up without selective schooling and agree its much better
Riven, there is a very good argument that we, as mothers, are the best carers for our children. Why on earth should we be paying for a third party to look after our children? They could never do as good a job as that child's own mother. Some mothers find themselves in positions where they are paying to work. That is unacceptable. In Canada you receive money for staying at home with your children whilst they are young.
I agree UQD, it is a very ignorant comment for anyone to make and not what I would expect from an educated person. But then who says you have to be intelligent just to be rich?
in a civillised society, why shouldn't one be 'entitled' to decent education/health care/community etc and all work together towards that. Thats why taxes are paid.
Cat, the local authority failed my family. When we moved here, at the wrong time re school lists, the Lea person told me that they didn't have a school place for my Y7 child. We had no choice but to go private.
We've taken that decision on the chin and made many sacrifices. We can't really afford it, which is why I have returned to work, and why we put the fees on the mortgage etc.
Yes, the Lea should provide us with decent school places at secondary level, but they don't - so we have done the best for our children in our own way. And we are pretty happy with how it has panned out. Shame on us.
I am not going to apologise for picking good degree courses and then working the corporate ladder. It hasn't been particularly easy, but it has been worth it.
It's called Socialism riven. But the well-off people don't want socialism ever to work because they don't want to share the profits they make from the hard work of the workers.
We all wants best. There were schools that were 'better' than others, 20 years ago aswell. And people would try and get in.Some would, some wouldn't. = LIFE And you may be pleasant to the woman down the road, but when it comes to selfishly wanting the best, all that flies out the window. Just seems natual to me. Hasn't it always been this way.
ST, you seem to be confusing your own situation with that of millions of people. Just because your situation meant that is what has happened to you, you cannot apply that same principle to others. It doesn't work that way. We are not all born the same, with the same brains, talents, personalities, friends, families and so on. I am happy that you are now settled and so should you be, proud even. But your argument that because you did it, it must be accessible to others is false and surely you must see that? It is in the government's best interests to ensure that these possibilities are not open to everyone, because we need workers in this country. That's why student fees were introduced, to encourage children from poorer families to go into manual labour because we were getting short of blue collar workers.
Just because you are a blue collar worker you shouldn't have to put up with second best. But unfortunately that is the reality. That is capitalism.
yeah, I am certainly a socialist and think the job of Govt is too put the people first. Over and above multi-nationals, other countries and profit. This country is more than rich enough for everyone to have a decent standard of living, schooling that brings out the best in each person and healthcare for every need. With that sort of attitude you'd generally get people working at their best, and helping society as they do so. But....everyone seems out for themselves and feels they are entitled but no-one else is. I don't know what the answer is but greed and yes, the sense of me me me entitlement is a hindrance. I think Expat and others might have been thibnking of those who cant be arsed but feel entitled to the best. I'd agree there. I think everyone should do what they can do and help care for those who can't. Not sure what one does about those who won't Apart from find out what leads to 'won't'?
Underlying this there is the interesting point that the main way to express one's dissatisfaction with the state system is to pay to go private.
You need to be in a particular position to do so.
This means that those parents who are doing so are not necessarily those who feel the state system is least effective or appropriate for their children - there may be thousands of those - but merely those who can pay to express this. A very different proposition.
My OP is making the point that we often think our children need the "best", which kind of assumes that there is also a mediocre and a worst. And that kind of assumes, in turn, that there are people who deserve these - or who, at the very least, can put up with them. That was what I was getting at.
But UQD, there are many levels of education. I myself have seen the good, the bad and the ugly. It would be naive to think otherwise.
Personally, I could not spend money on my house, on cars, clothes, holidays and entertainment, at the expense of my children's education. That's pretty much what it boils down to.
ST, people only see it that way when it is implied that others should do likewise. It is the inference that you worked very hard and therefore those who cannot afford private schools must not be working very hard at all. I apologise if this is not what you were saying, but then I fail to see why you would bring up your own personal situation if you were not using it to make a point?
The checkout girl at Sainsbury's earns around £15k a year, the drivers who delivers all the goods to the supermarket earns around £16k a year, the cleaner who keeps the supermarket clean earns around £10k. All of these people do an essential job. If we didn't have these people then we wouldn't be able to shop at supermarkets and the country would be swimming in dirt due to lack of cleaners.
The average annual fee for a private school is £10k although some can charge up to £25k. This makes it impossible for the vast majority of blue collar workers.
It seems to be a case of keeping the blue collar workers where they "belong", because access to a good education might give their offspring ambitions, and that would never do.
'Choice' has to be one of the most misused words going when it cames to education. Unless of course like ScienceTeacher you can afford to choose to go private.
ST, I presume you are good maths. Do the sums. Your checkout girl is hardly going to have much left over from her salary to spend on fast cars and holidays is she? You can't even get a mortgage on £15k a year.
If you cannot afford £10k a year on a private school then you might as well have a nice holiday once a year instead. How others spend their hard earned cash is hardly up for debate here.
Many workers are priced out of the exclusive education system.
UQD, in that case my view is simply that my child deserves the most "suitable" education. This does not necessarily mean the best when it comes to exam results. It can mean the school which prepares its children best for the realities of life: The school that provides different courses for different types of intelligence: The school that engenders a passion for learning: And so on and on.
I would like to think that rather than a better and worst there can be a "different" - i.e. more suitable for different strengths.
It smacks of losing an argument when people start to get personal, don't you think?
What does it matter which Uni UQD went to? University is different to school, hugely so. For one thing you do have a certain element of choice, and for another you can decide as an adult. For a child it has no say in the matter, it goes to whichever school is in the local region or whichever school mummy and daddy decide to pay for.
I often wonder what th children think. They see their parnets scrimp and save and neever go on holiday or have luxuries so they can have the 'best' education. So they can get a job and scrimp and save for their children..... Surely sending times with ones parents is more important, with less pressure? Studies have shown that moving out of ones 'class' is rare whatever you do (class as in most people earn what their parents earn) but compared to years ago most of us have luxuries unimagined. So what are we slaving our guts out for. Surely there's a happy medium that makes happy kids, less pressure to get the 'best' (which is matter of perception) and get some sort of home life/work balance? Not sure what I'm trying to say here but this frantic search for the 'best' for ones children seems to be leading to some very unhappy kids.
Because it is an example of a worker who provides a valuable service but gets paid very little. She could equally have been a truck driver, or factory worker, or cleaner, or hairdresser. Any would have served their purpose for my argument.
I also think that no matter what school your children go to, if you take an interest as parents, if you encourage and praise, then your children will do as well as their abilities allow.
But I agree that it is rather hard to take an interest when you've just got back from a hard shift work and are tired and hungry. Makes you wonder how much valuable time children get with their parents these days?
No ST, it's not ok when people get personal. You have chosen to relate how you rose up the class ladder to be able to afford a private education for your children. Your choice to divulge that information and therefore you must allow others to comment upon that. But when a person has not invited personal comments, it is rather rude to make them.
Unskilled job? Checkout girl? Truck driver? I couldn't drive a truck, could you? And I believe I already stated earlier down that these unskilled workers are the backbone of our economy. We need them to keep this country going, the fat cats need them to make their profits, the banks need them to loan money. Without them our economy, as it is, would collapse.
Not at all! If we all had the same opportunities then we might run out of unskilled workers as those children would no doubt want to go on to University and well paid jobs - the economy would collapse! Heavens no, we need state schools to keep unskilled workers where they belong and private schools for the rich kids who will no doubt one day play a part in helping capitalism to survive.
I felt entitled to TRY and get my child a place in what I considered the best in my town. Is that middle-class entitlement??
She didn't get in mind you! She got into the second best school in the town, and I do feel that she deserved that place as much as the next child to be honest. It was a church school, and my parents have been involved with the church for 40 yrs. They have made sandwiches, fundraised, polished brass, arranged flowers. As their grandchild, not as my child, I felt confident she deserved a place.
I think most parents think that their children deserve the best school. But some parents would be afraid that their children wouldn't fit in at the best school. They might worry their child would be bullied about their accent, or what their parents do for a living, or that the other parents would make them feel small. That's why they don't even APPLY. They make their choices for different reasons.
There are two really sh1t schools near me. The only thing wrong with the school is that it is near a massive council housing estate. That shouldn't matter. The children are SO young. But it sets a low precedent or something. The children from that school go on to the known-to-be-hopeless secondary schools. THEIR parents haven't the confidence to swear blind their mother was a catholic to get into a convent while at the same time going to church and giving the rector a bottle of wine at Christmas. These are the tricks of the confident parent.
how do you decide what is the 'best' school? I home educated the first 3 so didn't have this issue. With number 4 the SN school was too like a morgue (6 kids, all non-verbal strapped into chairs witing for adults to do something) but the local mainstream didn't have expertise to cope with a child so physically disabled they can't move but bright as a button. So I found a school with full inclusion and the resources to cope. Thats how I decided 'best'.
Riven, my parents did that! Scrimped and saved so that they could send us to private school. Worked out well for my brother, but I was in the bottom class and I was left to veg/study/evolve - nobody noticed or cared.
I remember going on holidays around Europe with my parents when we were 11 and 13. We had to share a coke between us. Miserable and pointless. My Dad thinks that we might remember the loire valley but all we remember is blowing up our airbeds and looking forward to that half a coke.
Rhubarb - don't worry about it. I understand completely your point. Sadly some people really don't believe in equality of opportunity - usually because they know damn well that if there was real equality then their kids wouldnt cut the mustard!!
I am of the opinion that a good proportion of the schools panic, getting to the 'best', is not about the actual education on offer, but about getting into a school where a greater proportion - preferably all - are 'people like us'.
That's why it is of particular issue in London, where within a tiny area you can have very very wide demographic.
And explains the mania for getting into faith schools. I am sure most stick to proper admission criteria, and as such, actually offer 'the best' to children whose parents can't play the buy-house-in-catchement system.however the 'go to church regularly' stipulation in over-subscribed schools does preclude those who are deeply chaotic and dissafected and can't do anything on a regular basis or with routine and discipline - and those who don't care enough about education to take anything other than the path of least resistance.
you might be right there. Best means 'like us'. I've seen enough threads on poeple not wanting schools that have immigrant children in or, heavens forbid, disabled ones. Go to the nearest school so you can walk there. (this is for town and city folk, not rural obviously)
I guess a lot depends on how narrow or wide your view is. Some people seem to go through life with very little sense of collective responsibility. They are totally obsessed with their own nuclear family unit and everyone else can go hang, whereas other people genuinely have more interest in how wider society fares. The thing is, ultimately our children will all have to live in the real world. Which will inevitably involve purchasing goods from the check out girl at the supermarket. Maybe even coming across (heavens forbid) people with a disability or from a different background. So probably an education that doesn't segregate in an extreme way is desirable.
I don't think that anyone necessarily has the right to the best school, because the implication is that other people might not have that right, or are in some way undeserving. Neither do I think that in some Golden Age bad schools did not exist, but the results of poor schooling in a more information orientated age are more damaging for both individuals and for society as a whole. It is bad for the whole society and economy that so many of our children come out of school unqualified, demotivated and indeed unfit for work. There is no evidence that producing unproductice citizens is helpful to anyone (even the rich) and historically countries tend to import unskilled labour when there are shortages.
In unswer to UQDs questions, no I don't feel entitled, but I do feel very fortunate to have more options at my disposal than most to make sure that my children go to a school that suits them and where they have the chance to fulfill their potential.
As to the variation, well there will always be some, but we should be working harder as a society to make sure the variation is positive, or at least that the worst schools are still "good enough".
As to whether it is in some way parents' "fault", no I don't think it is, because if there is variation you will always get some gaming. I think it's human nature for those who can gain advantage for their children to do so.
oh and for what it's worth my ds has got a place at the local school at the end of the road which just happens to be the 'best' school in the county. but that wasn't actually my first choice on my school application, and am not entirely convinced it is the 'best' school for my ds, but hey ho, i'm grateful for what i've got.
I am not British. I come from a country with few private schools, in fact there weren't ANY in my home town (industrial port town, pop. 120 000ish).
You went to the school closest to where you lived. Period. Nobody 'tried' to get into anywhere.
We may not have had any choice, but there didn't seem to be any sink schools. Of course, neither was there an Eton. They were are good enough. I grew up on a medium-dodgy estate fwiw.
I think of when dd is older, will I have to impersonate an Anglican/rent a PO box/pay a squillion quid so that she can have what I had for free?
Do I think I am entitled to the "best" school for my child. It depends what you mean.
I think that every child is entitlted to the best type of provision. For my son the best type of provision is the mainsteam infant school around the corner. The school had a "good" in its last OFSTED and its good enough for my son.
What I find shocking is that a lot of children with major special needs do not get the best school for them. For example in our county there were more kids with learning difficulties who wanted a place in an MLD special school than there are places. Instead of opening another MLD school our country wants to close another MLD school and force even more children into mainsteam.
Or else children with extensive special needs who are in mainsteam school do not get the levels of funding to make it work. Don't get me wrong, I think that inclusion can work well, but it needs to be paid for otherwise its unfair on everyone.
Rhubarb has made some excellent posts here. What surprises me is that ST is so blinkered, she can't see the point that has been clearly explained by Rhubarb. Nobody is saying you haven't had to make choices and decisions that you'd prefer not to have, in order to afford the school fees, but surely it isn't that difficult to understand that you have to be in a certain income bracket to be able to make those choices? I totally agree with the people who have said that the 'best' school according to someone else's criteria is not necessarily the 'best' school for your dcs - you have to go and find out for yourself. Re- the person that said they felt there were bad schools 20 years ago too - we know there were, but what I think is that the divide has become much bigger. It used to be most schools were fine / ok / good enough / or whatever you want to call it - where the supported children fulfilled their potential, and each of these schools would have people who failed to fulfil their potential. By 2008 however - certainly where I live (maybe it's a big city thing ? I don't know) the schools are much more divided into 'schools you'd move house to get into' and 'schools you'd move house to avoid'. There are several schools in the city I would not let my children into, and I don't think that was the case 20, 30, or 40 years ago.
I am entitled to pick work that pays well and work very hard indeed so that I can then pay for the best schools for my children. In a welfare state those of us who pay pretty high taxes are also entitled to know there is some back stop (even if fairly low grade) state entitlement there if we need it too.
I don't think most schools were fine 20 or 30 years ago at all. Only 15% of children went to university and most didn't do A levels for a start. In some senses state schools are better now than they were
I am now considered to be ‘middle class’ but my roots are very much working class. I somehow managed to pass my eleven plus and went to a grammar school (the only child at the time from my whole council estate). My parents appealed against me having this place because they could not afford the uniform and never attended a parents evening (probably, sadly, because they felt inferior). I was the only child out of four children in the family to get to a grammar school. My mother had the expectation that girls should be in the home and not have a career so I left school. Going to uni just seemed a bridge too far as no one in our extended family had ever done so. And it wasn’t until I was In my 30’s that I was able to return to study and completed a degree which gave me a health professionals qualification – I now work in the NHS.
I wonder firstly, how life would have turned out if I had not atteded the grammar school – my siblings and friends who lived on the council estate where I lived, went to local poor secondary schools – they are still in very low paid jobs . Grammar education did me a favour but a dis-service to childhood friends and siblings. For this reason, I would like to see an end to grammar schools.
Secondly, I wonder how would life be for my siblings if my parents had understood the value of education, encouraged, wanted and fought for the ‘best’ for their children?
Having the opportunity of a good education made available to me raised my expectations, gave me an understanding of ‘how the other half lived’and 'ticked' and undoubtedly had a hand in my eventually doing a degree and becoming ‘middle class’ with nice house etc and being better able to advocate for my own children to give them opportunities in life. How unfair is that?
Life is not fair but those who are amongst the ‘haves’ need to be helping to create a level playing field for the ‘have nots’. If we see education for our dc’s as an ‘entitlement’ it is unlikely that we will be thinking in a social justice frame of mind and even less likely that we will care about the less privileged. And when I say ‘level playing field’, that does not mean that all should start from the same point – some need extra support just to give them access to the same opportunities as others. and for me personally, that means instilling a sense of gratitude rather than 'we deserved this' in our children when they do get positive life opportunities. (I do appreciate of course that there are many caring 'middle class' people on mumsnet so I hope this doesn't sound preachy - I don't usually post )
Science Teacher you are so far up your own bum.
. Grammar education did me a favour but a dis-service to childhood friends and siblings. For this reason, I would like to see an end to grammar schools.
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