Actually I think I am being unreasonable.

I am moving to NZ in Jan. Today I told my mum that I had bought the tickets and she just said "well, I'm not going to pretend I'm happy for you" and then wouldn't talk about it any more. I understand that she is upset that I will be on the other side of the world with her grandchild, but it is an exciting move for me and a little support would be nice. I need to be able to talk about it, but she just goes all quiet or changes the subject.

aargggggghhhhh. I was all happy and now I feel kind of deflated.

I don't think you are being unreasonable...I'm sorry to hear she is'nt happy for you
My only thought is maybe she wil come round in time, Sorry to be no help...
Hope all goes well

YABU

she's obviously upset about you going. I would be devastated if my daughter moved to the other side of the world with my grandchild! give her a break. she'll get used to the idea in time. if you need someone to talk about it with, phone a supportive friend instead.

good plan, if I had any!

no, I know IABU, I will just wait until she is used to the idea before bringing it up again. It's just funny how my mum is only thinking about how sad SHE is, and not about how I feel. My sister is sad too, keeps crying on the phone to me, but she realises the move is a good idea and is just thinking about when she can come and visit.

Cor blimey you are being incredibly self-centered.
She's your mother fgs and you're moving to the other side of the world, couldn't get much further away if you tried.
You thought she would be pleased for you?

You need to stop thinking about yourself, your poor mum

I AM being self-centred, I can't run my life according to what would make my mum happy. I'm not expecting her to be thrilled about it, but maybe to realise that I am doing what's best for me and ds.

Is there any reason why she might think it isn't the best plan - apart from her dd and grandson being on t he other side of the world?

just the two of you moving?

have you relatives there.?

shame though that she can't be happy for you even if she is not happy herself.

she will never be used to it

it is devastating for her

it is your job to support her through this

you are her child fgs, you were her baby, she brought you up and watched you grow and now she is going to be a world away from you

YABincrediblyselfishlyU

I can't beleive you lot!
Mum is beeing a nutter!
How awful to make Bean feel lkie this. She can't live her life for her mother!!!

Blimey.

YANBU to want a better life for you and your child, however knowing 2 mothers whose children live in Australia/NZ then you need to be a little more understanding.

Good luck with all your plans.

I think she probably didn't think you would go until you got the tickets today so maybe she is in shock.
Give her time my sl and her dd went last year to Adelaide and love it but we all found it hard to come to terms with them going.
I don't think she will be 'pleased' maybe but she can be 'supportive' just give her time to get used to it.

"she just goes all quiet or changes the subject."

oh you are right moondog, she is barking. I mean that is insane behaviour

I do understand that she is sad, but she is being a bit horrible about it. You can be sad and still be happy for someone. And you can definitely be sad and still talk about it.

I'm a bit upset, and a teeny bit angry, because I wouldn't even be in the UK if my parents had left NZ one year later than they did. They knew I would stay for good if they left it another year and so I ended up in the UK in a new school doing my A levels in one year and being miserable. The being miserable bit is kind of my fault, and I wouldn't have ds if I had stayed in NZ but I still feel a bit 'what if'.

Eh?
You mean you started in NZ?
Capp it seems mad to me.My parents moved abroad years ago, as is the case with my sisters and I. We miss each other but would find it very weird indeed if disapproval expressed about plans. FFS we are grown ups now.

We moved around a lot when I was little but settled in NZ when I was 8 or 9 and I don't really remember anything before that. We moved back to the UK when I was 18.

How can it be best for your ds to be separated from all his family? That is madness.

He wont be separated from all his family. He will have me. It is nice to have grandparents around but it's not essential, I was perfectly happy growing up in NZ with no family other than my parents and sister.

So it was fine for them to leave their family but not for you to leave yours?

with the internet we are never that far away,
web cams and stuff

<<Ps what ever happened to your man??>> your old old flame
ignore if you wish,

I live apart from my dh and have done for 7 years.
it's not an issue.

it was fine when they did it, and my mum knew her mum would never visit, she wouldn't get on a plane. I know my family will visit, my sister is already planning to come over at Easter.

Exactly Bean.
Therefore i would smile and say 'I know you are feeling sad mum,but I really need to do this'

I don't think YABU at all. It is your life.

My mum would never ever ever say anything negative about my choosing to live abroad. I've done it twice now and she's always been encouraging and supportive. She wants me to live my life to the full. She has her own life. Sure she missed me but we phoned, emailed and now we could Skype if I were abroad again.

Parents need to understand that their children's lives don't revolved around them. It's painful but it's not the children's job to keep their parents company in their old age.

You go for it, beansmum. I hope NZ brings you much happiness. Your mum will come round and remember to be supportive with your child if he or she decides to live abroad when they're grown up.

(my non-bloke is gallivanting all over europe at the mo, but will see him before he goes back to work in June and tell him my plans. And tell him how I feel and then probably never see him again!)

good on yer

I think it's selfish of you to take him away from his family.
A child benfits from having many family members around.
The only person benefiting from this move is you.

<rolls eyes>
Tell ya what Bean.It was bloody selfish of you ever to leave the family home and presume to have al ife of your own!

you go to NZ if you want, fgs,
your child will benefit from the new experience and how happy it will make you.

kittywise - you don't really know enough about my situation to say who will benefit from this move...unless you are my mum?

Kittywise what an incredible manipulative thing to say "How can it be best for your ds to be separated from all his family? That is madness".

I am pretty sure that beansmum's child is going to be fine. It sounds like he has the love and support of his parents. They can still keep in contact by email, letters, phonecalls and visits.

My inlaws actually saw more of us when we lived abroad than when we lived 20 minutes drive away from them.

More v true.
As product of 'divided family' of many years back,I have seen my own lot more often than dh has seen his (2 hours away)

Yes, how dare you leave home, bean?

Suspect lots of those anti your move on here fully expect their children to live next door as adults and will be terribly resentful of their children choosing to live their own lives - without their parents. God forbid!

My oldest son lives in America and I am glad he is happy there (he's married to an American) but it pains my heart that he is so far away and it will always hurt. At the moment it's ok because dh and I are expats anyway, but I don't care to consider the future when he and his dw will probably have dc and it will be expensive for them to visit and dh and I may be too decrepit to make the trip to Ca.

I think maybe your mum is in shock, can only see negatives at the moment, and needs time to think on things.

Hi Bean,
I think you are doing a really positive thing and I am actually a little envious of you! Would love to have the opportunity to move overseas....especially to NZ. I have a few friends who have all moved over there (to live with NZ partners) and they all absolutely love it & have no plans to move back again.
But anyway...I didn't come on here to waffle. You know it's the right choice for you & your little 'un. I was thinking that maybe you could soften your mum up by talking about when she is going to come to visit you. Could you make this about planning a lovely holiday for her and coming to see you settled into your new home....obviously a couple of months after you've got there? Would she come to visit? Is money an issue? If she snubs you after that then sod her I say!

wow popple"If she snubs you after that then sod her I say!"
How can you suggest simply throwing away another human being just because they don't agree with you and do what you want?
So family are quite disposable to you it seems?
Scary, scary attitude

I think what she means is that there's only so much the OP can do to keep her mum happy. The OP can't sacrifice her own happiness for someone else's. A mother should bless her adult child's choices, surely? Obviously not if they involve abuse of some sort. Oh no, now you're going to tell us emigrating is abuse!

Winky I think she is denying her ds a chance to be with his family and I think that that is an awful thing to do to both the family and the child.

I moved to Oz when I was 21. My parents were incredibly supportive, even though they were worried about their 'little girl' being so far away. I will never really know how upset they were, but they also entered into my excitement and that meant a lot to me. But then I have a very good relationship with my parents.

Kitty, she's living her life. That is not a crime. The family can see her and her child by visiting. That's what most families do. It's normal and balanced.

What will happen if your kids want to emigrate, Kitty? Will you lay on the guilts to make them stay?

No I hope I wouldn't winky , but I would think that there was something wrong with their upbringing if family meant that little to them that they were quite happy to conduct their family relationships long distance.

it's not a matter of getting away from your family, it is living your life with your children and/or partner

I love my parents and I wish that I didn't have to live on the other side of the world from them but it IS what is best for ds and me and that is the most important thing. Having your parents around once you are an adult is not essential, and it is definitely not essential for a child to have his grandparents around. Anyway, they will visit and email and we can still chat on the phone. Kittywise - I am pretty angry that you would suggest I am not putting ds's needs first, of course I am, followed by my own. My parents come a bit further down the list of people I need to consider and it would be a bit weird if that wasn't the case.

Kittywise, you're being extremely unpleasant. It's Beansmum's life and if she wants to go back to NZ, then that's up to her, not her mother. We only get one life (as far as we know), and it should be lived to the full, doing, as far as possible and within the law, what is right for us.

If I had done what my mother wanted, I would never have left home, would have worked locally as a typist and looked after her in her dotage. Thankfully I didn't do as she wanted. I've got a family of my own and a good career.

You need to know when to cut the apron strings and Beansmum's mother clearly doesn't. Beansmum is spot on to say that her parents come further down the list of people she needs to consider - it's her and her son who should come first.

Kittywise - out of interest, would you apply emotional blackmail to try and keep your children in UK if they wanted to move overseas?

presumably that would never happen. It's only when there is something wrong with your upbringing that you would think of moving away from your parents.

YANBU.

You cannot live your life and your ds's life around her. She needs to emotionally mature if that is all the response she is capable of. She could at least say 'give me some time to get used to the idea, I just feel confused/sad at the moment, but I will support you to do this'.

Your doing the right thing for you and ds...trust your feelings...not someone elses.

YANBU
You have to do what's best for you and your son.
My DD's Dad who doesn't want to know her incidently is Australian, he lives there and I'll do anything I can to get DD dual citizenship if it's possible.
I dread the thought of her living on the other side of the world but it's not about me, it's about her and giving her all the opportunities I can in life

I think YABU really. I think that grandparents are hugely important in children's lives and vice versa. So her feelings of sadness and loss are understandable. Some reassurance is called for - why don't you set her up with a PC and webcam if she doesn't have these already and promise her lots of skyping and regular contact.

I agree that it is unreasonable to expect my parents to be happy I am leaving, but I don't think it is unreasonable to move or to expect to talk about it. And I don't think my mum chose her words very well when she said "I'm not going to pretend I'm happy for you" surely she can be happy for me without being happy I am leaving IYSWIM.

Is there more to it than the distance involved?Are there any other reasons why she might think it's a bad idea? Do you have a job to go to? Support?

Agree that it's probably a question of her getting used to the idea - it is a long way. At least she's not saying things like "what on earth can you eat out there?" as obviously they don't have food; or "what if lo gets ill?" as of course they only have witch doctors and voodoo. We were bombarded by these ludicrous questions from MIL when we were talking about living abroad - and we were only talking about FRANCE ffs!! She even had dd at it!

Good luck to you. I'm excited for you.

I don't think there is anything more to it than just being sad that I'll not be as near as I am now. I'm going to uni, starting feb 09. I have friends over there and my parents have good friends who live near the uni I will be at. They would look after me if anything went wrong. From what my sister has said to me I think my parents knew I would go back eventually, they were just hoping it wouldn't be for a while.

I think I was feeling a bit sorry for myself yesterday, I know my mum is finding it hard and she'll support me once she gets used to the idea. She was quite chatty on the phone this morning as long as I didn't mention moving.

My brother left for Oz about five years ago and my parents have found it very difficult because my father can't fly as a result of his health. They miss my brother and his family very much. It's had a knock-on effect on our family, too, because I now feel entirely responsible for my parents when something goes wrong.

It's hard to be the stay-at-homes when you're older and perhaps your health is starting to fade. Sometimes I look at my brother's photos of another glorious beach weekend and think, hmn, lovely, but where was HE when my parents needed family? I know this sounds selfish but it's the reality for us. My husband would like to move to Scotland but we can't because that would mean my parents would have no family at all within 500 miles of them and I just think it's not on to leave aging people without support.

Probably none of the above is pertinent to the OP's situation, though! It's a hard issue for everyone.

Bizarrely I have some friends who emigrated and one of the reasons they cited was that their parents were getting elderly and needed care and they didn't want to be responsible. I know that's not the case here - but Bridie's post called them to mind.

Some people are weird. If I thought my parents actually NEEDED me I wouldn't think of leaving. They are only early 50s and both work full time, I think they will cope without me!

Oh beans, of course she should be supportive but I can understand her being a bit miserable. If ds ever decides to up sticks, I'll plaster a big fake smile on my face and do my crying in private, I hope!

I have a friend who has lived abroad ever since university, about 20 years now. He's an only child and I know he's found it hard being so far away since his father died and his mother went downhill - he's come back as often as he can but his job and his life is in the US so it's not that often. Tricky. But I know his mother wouldn't have dreamt of stopping him going.

And his job is very specialised, I don't think he could work anywhere else - he dreams up what might happen to computers in 20 years' time, as far as I can understand it.

Oh I can totally relate to this!!!

I decided to study abroad in Scotland (from Chicago) and told my mom...this was 3 years ago mind you and she FREAKED! I was only gone 6 months, however I met and fell in love with the man of my dreams!

I came home and told her of my plans to marry him and move here. She cried and said everyone always leaves her...and well, made things very hard. She said a very similar thing to me... I said wouldn't you rather me be happy? And she replied...no.

So I ended up marrying my now husband, who she doesn't like (i think just to spite me)...I moved to Scotland and then fell pregnant!

She didn't even talk about my pregnancy, instead asked what I was going to do about it...what kind of question is that?? What is there to do? I don't even want to think about what she could have been implying. Since then (when I was 6 week pregnant she has never mentioned my preg. or my daughter again)

I then had my baby daughter, and she is now near 7 months old and my mom never sent a single thing to me or my daughter. I have no teddies to can tell my Emma that her gma gave her...I didn't even get an e-card on Mother's Day.

I still love my mom, but I do not know how we went from best friends, to this monstocity of a relationship.

I wish things were different, but I was not happy...and now I am married to the man of my dreams and have a wonderful life and baby girl. We have not spoken in about 2 months now...and even though I cry over the lost relationship...I finally realized that I have to live my life for me and nobody else.

What's the update on your hunky Marine, Beansmum. I followed your last thread for a bit when he came to visit you. I haven't been online in a few weeks so don't know what happened when he and a friend came back to stay at yours?

emmabemmasmom, that's a really really sad story.

Yeah you know it is sad. I don't have a lot of people here...so it helps getting it out and talking about it

I am just not sure what to do.

Tomorrow is mother's day in the states, and I sent something cause I always do...but I did think why bother, she didn't send me anything. But I don't want to be like that.

She is very hard to talk to and always has excusses...I brought up my feelings once, before xmas, and she brushed it off like 'oh well i thought you were busy and i was planning on sending one big thing for xmas'...right so ok i dropped it...and xmas came and went with no pressies for my baby. So yeah...just wish I knew what to do to make it better without leaving my husband and pretending I never had a baby.

emmabemmasmom -, that puts my problems in perspective slightly!

My Marine hasn't come back yet, his/my friend isn't in the UK yet but they are coming to visit at some point, and I'll be going down to London to see them, and other friends, this month. I am going to tell him how I feel but not really expecting anything to happen. I think I just need to tell him and then move on.

Beansmum:

I think that is the best thing to do. You can only be honest and tell them how you feel. I honestly believe that a parent should support their child no matter what, even if they don't always agree. However, some parents just don't agree and then that is it.

I would love it if my mom were the 'perfect tv mom' who was all excited and helped me plan my wedding and sent bunnies and outfits to my baby girl. But, I got the mom I got and nobody is perfect.

So...after 3 years (hopefully you won't go thru the heartache I did in the process) I just started letting go. It still bothers me, and every now and then I cry and my husband gets all upset too. But I am happy with my life and I am a good person...so I just keep telling myself that.

It will get easier and hey...even though my mom isn't here for me right now, as long as we are both on this Earth there is still hope! So there is still hope for you too...

go and have a reat life is what i say!!! my family is incredibly scattered but we still love and support each other via email,calls etc. let's see, my mum lives in scotland, my gran lives in kenya, my dad and sisters live in japan, my brother's in london for 6mths then god only knows where he'll end up, aunt in sweden, cousin in usa and australia.... we've always been an extremely close knit family and now that we're starting families we all make the effort to keep in touch.

i have a friend who's mum lives 10mins away and they hardly see each other cos they say they can see each other any time so consequently don't see that much of each other.

we lived all over the world but my parents always knew i wasn't going to settle in japan with them and weren't shocked when i left at 18 to move to ireland. they were sad but supported me and they try to come and visit when money/time allows. i know when DS gets older he might want to move away and i will be sad but as a parent i hope i'll be there for him and smile even though i'm crying. good luck! hope the move goes well!

great life, can't spell today

YANBU to want a new life in NZ but you can't expect your mother to be instantly happy for you. It will be like a bereavement for her and you have to give her time to work through it. Just like a death there will be shock, anger and finally acceptance. She is going to lose you and her grandchildren, however much you keep in touch she is not going to see much of you and eventually she won't be able to travel. Be kind and give her time. Be positive-can she email? If not make sure she knows how. Find out air fares for a holiday etc.

Reading back I see they are only in their 50's so email won't be a problem and they should be fit to visit for at least 30 years!
Just give them time! They might find it exciting in the end!

schadenfreude I already answered the question you asked.

Those who think it is not particularly important to have grandparents around are really missing something.

I agree, kittywise.

Kittywise, I don't think there is anyone keener than me on family relationships-I am always joining threads saying be kind to grandparents, that the relationship is very important- but if you want to start a new life you shouldn't stay at home for the sake of your parents. I am prepared for the fact that when my DCs want to fly the nest they may go anywhere in the world! I won't hold them back. OP has parents in their 50's-both working-they can save up and visit. My DH's Australian cousin was back and forward more than once a year when her DD was in London with DCs for a couple of years. My Canadian cousin works just to pay for airfares over here to see her DS and grandson. Grandparents are important-I don't think OP wants to sever the relationship!! If my DSs want to settle in NZ I would treat it as an adventure!

So are DCs supposed to stay in the same town all their lives!!

Sorry wrote quickly-it was in reply to Kittywise and Bridie3 who seem to be using emotional blackmail!

I'm only moving overseas, I'm not cutting myself off completely! But thanks Kittywise, for making me realise how bad my mum COULD be, your kids are going to have fun when they want to leave home and lead their own lives! My mum wouldn't dream of calling me selfish or suggesting I would do anything to hurt ds and I know she will be supportive once she gets used to the idea.

How can you emotionally blackmail someone you've never even met? There's nothing in it for me if the OP goes or stays!

beansmum are your psychic now? You have no idea regarding the relationship I have with my kids so don't presume to.
You asked if you were being unreasonable and I have answered that I think you are, very much so.
Judging by your reaction you didn't really want that questioned answered at all .
If you don't like an answer that doesn't make you feel better about making your mother sad then don't ask.

If my children decide to move away to the other side of the world then I will be very sad.
I will try my best to be happy outwardly. I will thought think it extraordinarily sad for us all as a family that we don't stay within easy visiting distance.

You couldn't get mucj further than NZ though.

I am guessing that your don't feel attached to your family?

yes, bridie I agree with you. I don't care what you do.

I think it's a terrible shame for your ds.

You go for it beansmum-I hope that it works out well-I am sure it will!
I am sorry I didn't read it properly to start, I thought your Mum was old and doddery and then found out she was young; and then I see that NZ is home to you anyway. If your parent's brought you up in NZ they can't be surprised that you might want to go back! They must have left their families to go in the first place.
I have loved being a Mum,but I have brought up my DCs to be adventurous and free. I am not expecting them to settle down in the next street or look after me in my old age! I will be sad if they live on the other side of the world but I would look to the positive. We have a good relationship so it would carry on, even though miles apart! I think if you go to a new country you are often more appreciative and more eager to keep in touch with the people you left behind.

It's not really any of your business how I feel about my family, but actually I love them very much and am very close to them all.

My actual question was AIBU to be upset that my mum can't be happy for me, and I think we have established that yes IABU. You are right in thinking that I don't paricularly want to hear what other people think about whether I should go or not, I have already decided that moving is the best thing for me and for ds. As you know nothing about my situation you can't comment on that. Well you can, but you will be talking nonsense.

Bridie3, it may be nothing to you whether beansmum goes or stays, but agreeing with kittywise that she is selfish seems to be piling on the emotional blackmail. Sometimes you have to be selfish and put yourself first-this is one of those occasions IMO.

paricularly = particularly

Its hard Bean. My mum and dad were really upset when I moved from UK to Switzerland 10 years ago with their only (at the time) grandchild, then I moved to Holland which is closer but still not exactly next door. I completely agree that you have to do what is best for you and your daughter but please try to understand your mum's position. I never realised how hard it was for my parents who now have another grandchild who lives 10 mins away and whom they feel much closer to than to my kids

My parents are fantastic though and never criticised me but I think I handled it badly at the time and was very insensitive

Sorry--where did I agree to anyone being selfish??

I agree with Kittywise that children's relationships with their grandparents is important. May I politely suggest you reread my messages before you continue to put words into my virtual mouth ;) ?

Kittywise was not just saying that relationships with grandparents were important-I can agree on that wholeheartedly-she was saying that they were so important that:

'I think it's selfish of you to take him away from his family.
A child benfits from having many family members around.
The only person benefiting from this move is you.'

and

'Winky I think she is denying her ds a chance to be with his family and I think that that is an awful thing to do to both the family and the child.'

and more in that vein-someone else actually tells her that she is being unpleasant!

May I politely suggest that you read all a posters messages before you agree with her, unless you actually quote the part that you agree with.

maybe bridie agrees with me

You don't have to be rude Abbey

Good luck with your move, obviously your Mum will be sad that you are both moving so far away, but she should be glad that you are both happy. You don't have to live near your parents all their life, that is a ridiculous notion.

I didn't think that I was being rude, Kittywise! Beansmum asked if she was being unreasonable to expect her Mum to be happy that she was going to NZ.The general concensus was that she was being unreasonable and she had to expect her Mum to be sad (which I think she realised anyway).You were the one who said she was unreasonable to go to NZ which was not the question-she is booked to go in January. You were quite unpleasant and insinuated that she couldn't love her parents if she went ahead! Beansmum got a bit annoyed saying:

'But thanks Kittywise, for making me realise how bad my mum COULD be, your kids are going to have fun when they want to leave home and lead their own lives! My mum wouldn't dream of calling me selfish or suggesting I would do anything to hurt ds and I know she will be supportive once she gets used to the idea.'

I said that it was emotional blackmail and Bridie3 took offence.

I apologise beansmum if I have got anything wrong-I hold by my original comment that it is like bereavement and her Mum has to work through shock and anger before she gets to acceptance. Her parents are young, they brought her up in NZ in the first place and have (hopefully) at least 30 years to visit!!

you are central to her world.she is devastated, scared and is to hurt to support you. for her this is akin to a bereavement - really it is

BUT give it time, emails, photos, buy a webcam so she can see you

encourage her to keep contact via email etc. the immediacy is a great comfort

you are embarking on an exciting fantastic time, going to a beayutiful country where the quality of life is fantsatic you will buy property, LO attend school (have a funny hybrid accent) meet new friends.how exciting

and the world is smaller.

anyway you don't need to live next door to be close. you as a family have got needs, and if that involves moving well fair enough

maybe plan a nice meal as a send off

Best wishes

Beansmum - I am very jealous. My Godmother emigrated to NZ 12 yrs ago and I have only managed to visit her there once, but they have come back for a handful of visits. Her eldest son was half way through his A levels when they moved and her mum did all she could to persuade him to stay with her and not move with his family 'for the good of his education.' I know how hurt she was that her own mother would try to split her family up. (BTW he married out there 2yrs ago and now has the cutest baby kiwi!)
I would emigrate and take my inlaws only grandchild with me without hesitation, but I know DH will not move while his Grandmas still with us.
Your mum will get used to the idea - and isn't she looking forward to revisiting places?

Now my parents sound like they don't really love me!

They just weren't/wouldn't be devastated by my moving abroad. They'd never expect me to curtail my life because of them. In fact, they'd be exasperated with me if I get on with everything that I wanted to do.

Do you think lots of parents envisage their children sticking around the neighbourhood for the rest of their lives? Or even the same country?

I want my lot to see the world as their oyster. Their living abroad means great trips for me!