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Hi Coggy - good luck. Are you sniffing Burserlin now then? Mine is a frozen embryo transfer but medicated (with drugs rather than natural) - I'm due to start sniffing on Saturday and have already been taking some progesterone - it's been giving me PMT x 200 but only now and then which is weird!!
Top tip re injections - I found last time it helped to ice the injection site before with a freezer block type thing - numbed it really well.
No sniffing here! I'm doing short protocol which may well be different??
Got to start progesterone on CD21 until they tell me to stop with a view to the procedure actually taking place mid-Feb I think.
I've gone through 4 cycles of IUI already this year so I'm well used to the old jabbings - never thought about numbing the injection site though....TOP TIP!!!!!
Thought I would pop in and say hi - not planning any immediate treatment but have had 2 cycles of ivf and my ds (9 months) is the result of fet (natural). Good luck to all of you starting soon.
I am starting ivf around the middle of jan. It will be my 14th cycle and I have one DS nearly 3 as a result of my 10th attempt. I am doing a cetrotide protocol, start injecting fsh on day 2 or 3 and then when follicles are about 14mm then I injecting cetrotide to stop ovulating. I have tried a few protocols, they mainly have the same sort of results, but I got pregnant on this one.
I don't find the injections a problem. Its the 2 ww that drives me completely insane.
Am also on the ttc after christmas thread....
Nice to see you coggy am glad you decided to give ivf a go. Keeping everything crossed for you.
Wow Soosy - you have been through this a lot of times. I hope this one works for you.
I'm hoping my 2ww will be short this time (I have frozen day 5 blastocysts so by the time the embryo transfer happens they will be poss day 6 and that only leaves 8 days til testing! Not that I waited til day 14 last time to test - think I started testing day 10!!) and also that ds will provide a distraction that wasn't there last time iyswim.
No frequent flyer discounts at my clinic, sadly. Infact the cost is now three times what we paid for our first cycle 10 years ago! (i got pg but had m/c, don't think I would have stuck it out if I hadn't).
MNpeace, can't you have your embryo transfer in a natural cycle? I found the sniffing to be vile. It doesn't really matter what time you do it (sniffing that is) as long it is the same time every day.
Notmyrtle, its good to have a break, I tried to do three cycles in one year (when I had my m/c) and my hair fell out. it is all a bit stressful, even when it works. Good luck for August
Thanks for the support I hope it works as we only have 3 attempts left, as dh was ill and we had to freeze sperm.... Plus I am now 38 so time is not exactly on our side.
Soosy - I think my clinic favours medicated and also I've had PCOS so I guess it is better this way....well that's what I'm telling myself as I psych myself up for the injections.
Let's try and keep this thread going - even if there aren't many of us and not all of us are going through treatment at the moment.
It would be nice (horrible word I know) as I know that it is really hard for those who haven't been through it all to understand what ivf is actually like. I am struggling to remember to take my folic acid at the moment, and to lose a little bit of weight, as my ovaries act as though they are polycystic, but I am ovulating, so the drugs work better if I am a little lighter. So MNpeace you must respond well to the drugs... if you are anything like me!
Hi I just took a look at the hoping to conceive in the new year thread or whatever it's called and decided not to post there as it IS just so different doing IVF. Understandably there's lots of discussion about timing sex, temping etc so it's just not the same....which is why I like the idea of this thread!
I guess Soosy I responded quite well last time - I think I had 14 folicles and 12 eggs but what we were very very lucky with was our embryo quality and the number that fertilised and carried on to blastocyst - very lucky.
But since this time it's a frozen cycle I'm worrying that we are using the ones which were less good and therefore the chances of success are lower - plus rates of success for FETs are just lower anyway aren't they.
If this one doesn't work we'll probably do one fresh cycle and then call it a day.
Hello...and Happy New Year wishes to all!! (almost in 2008 I guess?!)
Soosy....you must be fed-up of it all by now? I'm definitely joining you on the old weight-loss campaign (I do it every January y'know!!)
I've only got about 1/2 stone really necessary to lose but I also MUST eat better....SOOOOOOOOOO much alcohol and chocolate over Christmas.
I start my progesterone in a couple of weeks so after tonight I will be healthy and (reasonably) alcohol free.
How is the sniffing going PK?
I've been on LOTS of ttc threads in the past couple of years and I agree with your thoughts I must say. I feel as if I have had the same converstaions many, many times as people have 'left me behind' and new people have come (and also gone! )
This is fab to be able to moan and groan and get sympathy from people who know!!
I am a bit scared now. Not about the actual procedure, but about the finality of it all....I am trying not to think about that, but it's hard sometimes.
coggy, you shouldn't have any intra-muscular injections, except maybe the one to make you ovulate, but even that can be done with a small needle. Don't panic about the procedure, you will get pain relief and if it starts to hurt tell them and you can have more! Gas & air also helps with the odd follicle (esp the ones on the outside of the ovary.) You will be told not to eat or drink for a certain time before, find out what is the last time you can have fluids and drink as much as you can then ( a pint of water) wake up if you have to, it makes an enormous difference to your recovery.
Pk wow sounds like they have good drugs for you , no patches etc, is this because of the pcos? make sure the big needle is for injecting it might be for mixing. I did have a couple of glasses of fizz with dh and ds as dh had reached his target at work, so hopefully good bonus next year!
A very happy new year to you all, a fab 2008 and oodles of babies!
sorry pk, must have missed your first post completely. yes I am at the Chelsea & Westminster, i may not get frequent flyer, but I am their oldest customer!
Your embryos must be good quality to get to that stage so don't worry.
Hi Soosy - I was 31 when we did the original treatment for ds (now 2.5) and dh is 6 years older.
I don't know why the embryos were so amazing - they were all grade 1 apart from 1 the first day or two and the embryologist said that was very very rare.
I had acupuncture and wondered if that had made a difference.
I had acupuncture when I finally conceived ds and am having it now in preparation for the next cycle. My consultant said there are some studies which show that acupuncture is helpful with implantation, which seems to be the problem when we are doing ivf, as although I don't have such splendid results as you I do quite well, with all grade 1's and 2's, but not all carry on dividing. The last time, at the grand old age of 37, I managed to produce 13 eggs.
They say pk that if you have polycystic ovaries you maintain your fertility for longer, so there are some benefits.
I didn't know that soosy - will console myself when feeling fat and spotty that there is an upside - lol!
Am feeling so ridiculously bloated today - like I want to hide away from the world - would be really bad if anyone saw my bloated tummy and asked if I were pregnant - they might get a smack in the face!
Hi Good idea - an IVF thread. I dont think I belong in the ttc threads. We are starting a GIFT IVF cycle in late Jan. Our clinic recommends GIFT in cases of serial failure - its our 8th cycle. We have a miracle DD of 2.5 (who was conceived naturally while waiting for more treatment). Our problem is probably an egg chromosomal one.
Im worried about my negative feelings impacting on the cycle. I need to turn my thoughts to hope that it can work rather than just dreading the failure. But I find it so stressful, especially as all our friends and close family are pg with apparent ease.
PK - I think acupuncture can make a huge difference, not just to easing the symptoms but also I read somewhere egg quality too.
Soosy and Coggy - Fingers and toes crossed! I always underestimate the impact of drug side effects which seem to really floor me every time. But at least with every dose I felt I was doing something constructive, even though I dread the injections. Our ECs are done under sedation which is great (would recommend) so you dont know anything about it.
Heres hoping that 2008 is a happy year and brings us all our dreams!
Hi sticki, I have never been offered GIFT, even though like you we have had serial failure. Are you at a London Clinic? Don't worry about negative thoughts, I have good and negative thoughts the whole time I do ivf, tis the nature of the beast i suppose.
PK, that is the bit i hate about the drugs the bloating, after my last attempt, last June, everyone told me I had lost loads of weight, but actually it was just stopping taking those damned cyclogest pessaries ugh...
How are you doing coggy.. I've 11days or there about before I start injecting. Got to get my prescription filled!!!
Soosy - reckon I'll be starting the injections at around the very same time as you.
Think I might book some acupuncture in - I am worried about fitting it in this time as I hardly have any time without ds to work and have a massive project on but if it will help minimise side effects etc it will be worth it. Last time I had so few side effects and was having acu every week so it does hint that that's why things might have been different so far this time.
I am so bloated I feel like my jeans are going to burst open!!
I live in London and I found a fab acupuncturist who visits me at home. It has been interesting when my ds has been around but on the whole he has been v good. I usually have it in the morning when he is at nursery school, but it is the holidays a the moment.
I hope you can find someone to help, if you are in central London then I'll pass on her number.
I am just waiting for af to arrive so I can start my cycle.
I know what you mean about the bloating, no useful info to pass on I am afraid.
Thanks Soosy - I'm going to go to someone I have used before who happens to live v near me and is lovely.
I went to someone a bit further away in my first cycle of treatment and she was amazing and specialised in fertility issues and pregnancy but now with ds I don't think I can find time to do the journey.
Have felt happier today - not sure why but no PMT type grumps which is good. Are any of you at UCH?
PK - Glad you are feeling better today. Yes we are at UCH. We started at the old site and now the much larger one. Was an easy journey when I was working in central london but now a bit longer from home. The last cycle made me swear I wasnt going back but here we go again..... Its nice seeing all the same people and them knowing our history. We did think we would move clinics but havent summoned the extra energy to do so.
S - I took my DD to a few of the acup appointments I couldnt schedule in nursery time. I agree its a bit less relaxing trying not to let her trash the place. But needs must.... (I also had to take her up to UCH for scans/bloods etc which she loves but I didnt feel v comfortable in the waiting room etc)
Since our last cycle in Oct/Nov I have managed to comfort eat enough to keep up my bloated size - I had to buy some new jeans to wear during treatment and not showing signs of wanting to put them away. Choc is my downfall!
Hi Sticki - us too. I like them there. The new site is much much better isn't it. Am very much the same re feeling reluctant to take ds to the clinic as I feel it isn't terribly sensitive. That said first time round I didn't mind seeing people's kids there.
I just guess I'd feel really bad if he started behaving as 2 year olds do sometimes!
Am trying to wangle scheduling all but the Etransfer for when ds is at nursery which should work ok. Not sure what we're going to do for the ET as they only do them in the pm and ds only does nursery in the mornings.
I'm fine Soosy thanks. Just waiting to start on the progeserone tabs - 12th Jan - than I'll really feel like it's all beginning to happen!
Sticki - I read last night about doing a 7 or 10 day liver detox before preparing yourself for IVF drugs. It's in onme of Zita West's books and she says that it helps to cleanse your system before putting all those drugs back into them. I guess it's relevent for all of us in between treatments.
I'm going to read the rest of the chapter later on today (fell aslepp reading it last night!!) Light-weight!!!
I'll let you all know what it involves. I seriously need to now get a grip and realise that I must make the most of my body prior to IVF. Re-started Weight Watchers to kick-start me out of the puddings and wine!! Today has been good so far.....LOTS of water as recommended also.
I've just read back through the last few days properly.
Thanks for putting my mind at rest about the needles and all! I am a bit of a wimp I have to say!!! But usually the thought of these things is worse than the doing.
Hi Just wanted to wish all you ivfers all the best. A special hello to Coggy and Sossy hope your both ok. havent had time to read through the thread but where are you both in the process. Good Luck. I am back to ttc naturally at the mo just had a lapa nd dye.
Hi coggy, It sounds as though we are all starting treatment at the same time. Never read Zita West, I did do Foresight for about four years, now that is quite brutal, no red meat, white flour, booze. Lost loads of weight, but it was acupuncture that did it for me. So I'm sticking with that. Not entirely surprised you fell asleep though,pmsl!!!
Lots of water also recommended after et.
I wonder if you know each other, by sight pk and sticki? I say by sight, as certainly at the Chelsea & Westminster you don't actually speak to each other in the waiting room. Is it the same at UCH?
Finally picked up prescription today so it feels like its really happening.
God yes Soosy - no one ever conversed at Acu when I was there last time. It's all very hushed in the waiting room - hence especially not wanting to take ds there.
Yes we must have been doing treatment at pretty much the same time - I think it was Sept 04 for us.
Coggy Thanks for the info (and reminder) about the liver detox. I agree its a really good idea with all those drugs. I'll have a look at my old info - like Soosy I did a Foresight brutal diet change thingy years ago. Not sure I have the commitment for that now (just thinking how I would love a glass of wine tonight!). 7 days would be just about survivable!
No one ever looks at eachother in the waiting room, let alone talk. Perhaps a stolen glance whilse on the pretense of looking for a magazine. Yes PK - we have been doing treatment at the same times, so perhaps we have seen eachother there! I also never minded seeing other children there (perhaps gave me a little hope??) so hopefully others dont mind too much. We tend to run around outside until the last minute and hope they are not running too late.
I too feel I don't really belong on the TTC threads as frankly I've been TTC for 6 years now with NO success other than an IVF cycle 2 years ago resulting in our 14 month DD.
Am on day 7 of my second ever IVF cycle, downregging using the pill. Ironic just isn't the word, seeing my IVF clinic handing me a blister pack of contraceptive pills. I used buserelin to downreg last time but became a tad ....tetchy....shall we say on this, so didn't want to go for that again. Am waiting for my schedule of drugs and scans to turn up tomorrow so I know where I am for dates etc.
Reading about the needles etc has brought the nastiness of the injections back to me all over again. Deep joy at the thought of fiddling around with little vials and needles again.
Hi- I had IVF to concieve my ds (2.9). I followed most of Zita West's advice in a book called fertility and cnception. i didn't have acupunture but did have hypnotherpy which i think really helped with all aspects of the treatment including egg collection and transfer. i think you have to really make time for yourself and your body and as someone else said earlier drink lots and lots of water because ZWest says that your body cannot funtion 100% if it is dehydrated in anyway. Good luck everyone. still deciding whether to do ivf again.. it's hard work x x
Leo Leo - it would be so much easier just to have sex a couple of months in a row wouldn't it!
Onlyaphase - ice that injection site beforehand - numbs it. I wish someone could numb my squeamishness though - that's the worst bit! Reckon the first one again will be the worst and then we'll all be stabbing away, not quite happily but as a matter of routine. That is ironic you've been given the pill isn't it. I didn't know it could be used for downregging.
What are those of you who are just about to do cycles going to do with your dc's when you're having the actual transfer - I've been told by our clinic ds can't be there. Probably not a bad thing but I don't really know what to do with him (no kindly but sensible rellies nearby to take him and he doesn't do nursery in the pm)
MNPKF - its a tricky one isn't it, care of DCs during IVF. I have no childcare or relatives nearby (sadly my mother died several years ago and I would much rather not involve MiL).
Luckily DH's work has a really good policy for IVF so he can take time off for scans etc. In reality he will probably work at home for those days (maybe 6 of them?) and I will take myself off to the clinic while he babysits. Embryo collection is the time that is worrying me as we both need to be there for our various "duties", and we really can't take DD with us for the whole morning, and I won't be able to drive after the sedation. I have asked a very good friend to help out, but it is an enormous favour to ask - 90 min drive the night before plus 4 hours babysitting then drive back. Do you have a similar friend you could ask? Or else maybe a babysitter, or an extra session at nursery?
For embryo transfer, will probably have DH and DD in the car waiting for me. Not ideal, but neither is the whole bloody IVF process.
LOL at you worrying about being rude Soosy! The whole thing is enough to make you want to drop off isn't it???!!
I looked into the foresight info but have to confess to agreeing with you and sticki - it looked VERY full on and scary...and that was only reading about it!! I'm very impressed that you both managed to do it.
Cedar...I'm on CD13 and waiting another week or so before starting to take progesterone so that the clinic can time when I do my IVF. Probably scheduled for egg collection near to the end of Feb. I'm waiting foir a schedule to come through the post.....but nothing yet. Hopefully in the next couple of days otherwise I'll phone them.
Would it be a good idea to have a profile-type thing of each other eg. how many IVF tries, age, number of DC etc. or is that just really nosey of me??!!
MNPK - 1 previous cycle resulting in ds (2.6), Clinic: UCH, currently doing FET, transfer expected mid jan.
Coggy - 3 X clomid resulting in DS who was tragically stillborn, 4 IUIs, now 1st IVF - just has the letter W/B: 4th Feb for egg transfer (Haven't started any drugs yet - can that be right???!!!)
MNPK - 1 previous cycle resulting in ds (2.6), Clinic: UCH, currently doing FET, transfer expected mid jan.
Coggy - 3 X clomid resulting in DS who was tragically stillborn, 4 IUIs, now 1st IVF - just has the letter W/B: 4th Feb for egg transfer (Haven't started any drugs yet - can that be right???!!!)
Onlyaphase - 1 previous cycle two years ago resulting in DD (14 months) currently downregging to start another IVF cycle. No dates yet but expect to have egg collection around end Jan. Clinic not that hopeful this time due to my age (38) and poorish response last time.
Coggy - that sounds about right to me as you should be on the stimulating drugs for around 10-12 days only before egg collection. Downregging before that can last up to 4 weeks but often not, it depends on the clinic and their timetable. I also wanted to say how sorry I was to read your short history, and to see the loss of your DS. How very sad.
MNPK - did you say you were on a medicated FET? In my ignorance I would have thought that they would just monitor you and transfer the embryos at the appropriate time - what sort of drugs are they using?
MNPK - 1 previous cycle resulting in DS (2.6), clinic UCH, currently doing FET,transfer expected mid Jan.
Coggy - 3 X clomid resulting in DS who was tragically stillborn, 4 IUIs, now 1st IVF - just has the letter W/B: 4th Feb for egg transfer (Haven't started any drugs yet - can that be right???!!!)
Onlyaphase - 1 previous cycle two years ago resulting in DD (14 months) currently downregging to start another IVF cycle. No dates yet but expect to have egg collection around end Jan. Clinic not that hopeful this time due to my age (38) and poorish response last time.
soosy (38) - 9 icsi cycles, 2 fet's, first resulting in pg mmc at 10 weeks, 3 iui's with donor sperm, 4ivf cycles with donor sperm , first resulting in darling life saver ds (2.11) currently waiting to start 5th ivf cycle, which should start end next week, beginning week after. All at the Chelsea & Westminster.
Sorry its all a bit long and complicated, and yes I think I have had everything, but as you can tell we really wanted a family.
I know what you mean about childcare during treatment, like you onlyaphase, my mother isn't around and I would rather my mil didn't. DH usually takes time off, we live v close to the hospital and I have always walked home after sedation, Dh & Ds come to pick me up. The hospital do think I am nuts btw. The hospital have been v good during scans and sometimes the nurses play with DS or he has come in to the room with me, he is quite aware about what is going on this time and when I went to pick up my prescription, he asked if i was going to have an ultrasound and if he was coming too.
About it being easier to have sex to have children, it would be, but do you know I have got quite used to it now, takes about 10 years!
Dh had a big row with me last night about my being negative during the cycle (and generally in life) and that if I don't have positive stuff to say I shouldn't say it.
I feel this is a little unreasonable as heck who'd choose to do this treatment lark.
He says we chose to do it and should be grateful we at least have this option.
It is not him taking all the drugs and feeling shite though is it.
Anyway, has anyone got any tips for me on how to stay positive during this as I don't feel very positive right now....
MNPK, it is incredibly difficult to stay positive all the time. Sometimes I feel like your DH - we are all lucky to be living in a time when medicine allows treatment of our problems like this. But other times I just feel so resentful and cross and "why me" about the whole thing - like this week when most of my NCT group seem to be announcing or planning their second pregnancies, it can be so frustrating and agonising to hear them talk about this so casually.
TBH it probably is the drugs having this effect on you at the moment. I too feel incredibly down and tired all the time - combination of drugs, January blues, no sunshine, no money etc isn't the best thing in the world.
Also, is the negativity your way of protecting yourself if this cycle doesn't work out for you? You know, if you don't get excited about it and don't think it will work, then it won't matter so much if it doesn't work out?
Totally Only aphase re your last paragraph - I finally worked this out last night when talking to dh after that I just am not letting myself be positive as I am concentrating on the day to day of this and not the potential outcome. It's easier that way.
I'm so upset by this big row we had.
I feel really sad right now and I know it's partly the hormones but I just want my dh of all people to be there for me and I don't feel like I can be open about how I feel now - like I have to pretend it's all a bed of roses and I am so delighted to be doing this. Yes I agree it is great that we have this option unlike women 30 years ago but well I won't go on.
My lovely ds gave me a cuddle and that made me feel a bit better this morning at least.
Last time I didn't find the treatment stressful at all so this is a bit of a surprise really.
MNPK - 1 previous cycle resulting in DS (2.6), clinic UCH, currently doing FET,transfer expected mid Jan.
Coggy - 3 X clomid resulting in DS who was tragically stillborn, 4 IUIs, now 1st IVF - just has the letter W/B: 4th Feb for egg transfer (Haven't started any drugs yet - can that be right???!!!)
Onlyaphase - 1 previous cycle two years ago resulting in DD (14 months) currently downregging to start another IVF cycle. No dates yet but expect to have egg collection around end Jan. Clinic not that hopeful this time due to my age (38) and poorish response last time.
soosy (38) - 9 icsi cycles, 2 fet's, first resulting in pg mmc at 10 weeks, 3 iui's with donor sperm, 4ivf cycles with donor sperm , first resulting in darling life saver ds (2.11) currently waiting to start 5th ivf cycle, which should start end next week, beginning week after. All at the Chelsea & Westminster.
Sticki (35) UCH. 3 IUI cycles and 2 IVF failures before getting pg naturally whilst waiting for IVF with PGS. Wonderful DD 2.5 (yes a lifesaver). Since another 2 years of trying, IUI and IVF with PGS. Next month starting GIFT or IUI. Likely I have a chromosomal problem with my eggs (ruled out all other things).
PK - I find I cant find a balance of having hope that it might work and the alternative of not hoping too much in case it doesnt..... Its so natural to protect yourself, especially as treatment (and IF) is soo difficult emotionally.
From talking to my acupuncturist and Paul Serhal at UCH its really important to believe it will (or at least might) work. The only time I have managed to have complete positive thinking (apart from perhaps 1st cycle) was when I saw a hypnotherapist woman who was amazing and allowed me to stop the negativity for about 10 days of the 2WW. Thinking of going to see her again as even more negative now. I feel that in the scheme of a cycle another £60 to have hope is worth it. (Not sure where you are but hypno woman is in SW London if you want more info.)
Is there anyway you can find some time to do something fun with your DH? Cinema/meal out/walk in the park etc..... Treatment is really hard, and very hard on a relationship. Can you go and see a trashy movie for a couple of hours out?
Thanks Sticki. Serhal is very positive isn't he. I know he's a bit eccentric but I like that!
I think the negativity is more about me getting bogged down about having to take the drugs and whingeing about getting fat and spotty from them etc. more than about specifically thinking the treatment won't work. I am reasonably positive on the latter but I don't really link the two things so I have detached the day to day drugs etc from the outcome.
Last time I had an interesting experience whilst having acupuncture. I had literally never imagined or visualised myself with a baby but during one of the first sessions I started doing this and not particularly intentionally - it was most strange but I started thinking of this baby and being with a baby. It was quite inspiring!
Still waiting for my period - it's supposed to start about a week after downregging but this is the 10th day. I really want it to turn up as worrying I haven't downregged properly - ironically next month of course I will really want it not to turn up!
You guys are the only people I can ask for opinions on treatment options. I hope you dont mind me venting about something thats on my mind (long!)......
We are lined up for a GIFT IVF cycle to start down regging after my next period later this month. There is some empirical evidence that GIFT has a success rate of 40% after repeated failures vs 0% blastocyst IVF. This is because somehow doing a more natural treatment works better as the fallopian tubes do some kind of magic apparently and nurtures poor quality embryos that wouldnt survive in the lab. (GIFT is when they put the eggs and sperm back into the fallopian tubes by Lap directly after ET rather than culture embryos in lab.) Our problem is likely to be a chromosome issue with my eggs which means that only about 10% are potentially viable.
During our consultation Paul Serhal talked about IUI being also good in these scenarios because of the same 'more natural' reason. We were very negative about IUI because we have had 4 already with no success (and 5-6 good follicles each time) and he thinks you have to believe your treatment could work.
Anyway, whats going round my head is - was I wrong to dismiss IUI (although there isnt the empirical evidence)? IUI is much less invasive, doesnt need down regging and also needs less drugs.
I guess Im just dreading all the drugs, appointments etc and IUI would be a way of reducing it a bit. Another thought is that perhaps they would let me start down regging for the GIFT this month. That might help me to get on with it rather than feeling its hanging over me.
Thanks! This post (rant!) has helped me to understand my issue (ie chicken about the next cycle)... PK - Thanks v much for starting this thread.
Hmm this is tricky Sticki (bad rhyme there sorry!)
Have you thought of asking Mr Serhal which he would do if it were him quite bluntly?
Fundamentally of course you need to weigh up the estimated success rates and the amount of disruption/ drugs involved.
Is the rate he'd estimate for you for Iui much lower than that for the GIFT? And also how do you feel about several cycles of IUI again even if they don't involve drugs they could still be quite taxing emotionally?
Sorry don't think I've been much help - it's hard to know when it is so individual in terms of success rates isn't it.
Sticki - can totally see why you are leaning toward a more natural less drug based treatment. I agree with MNPF in that you need to think carefully about the differing chances of success with the different options you have.
Not sure how applicable this is to you, but what is your hormone profile like? Has anyone said anything about ovarian reserve at all? Just wondering whether if you feel time is running out, maybe go for the treatment with the best chance of success immediately? If you have lots of time left, may be you could be more relaxed about it.
Sorry if this wasn't helpful to you and good luck in whatever you decide to do.
Stiki, I should imagine that gift has a higher success rate as they can put back several mature eggs, whereas with iui the eggs cannot be seen before fertilisation. But like pk I would ask 'if I was your wife' question. It may not be a chromosomal thing, as we don't have that problem, infact apart from a male problem, they cannot see any reason why its not happening, since using donor sperm. 35 is considered quite young in treatment terms... Good Luck
Sorry to hear that you are feeling down pk - I always find that I swing from feeling fabulous to completely depressed when I do a cycle, and from what I understand it is completely normal. If you get to go for acupuncture tell them you are feeling down. I went for acupuncture after my Mum died and the first session was completely cathartic, I did have the cycle of ivf. iyswim.
Trying not to eat chocolate and finding it v hard, started raiding DS's christmas stash last night.... which is very mean... I will replace it.
Thanks Soosy. Had a good chat with dh just now. Fundamentally we decided we would treat this phase (ie. during treatment) as an extraordinary period and not make judgments about each other based on this.
Also told him he needs to make more of an effort to be supportive and we discussed specific ways of doing this.
In typical bloke style he said that he wouldn't want to be fussed over so assumed I wouldn't (or something like that).
Never mind Men are from Mars.....they're from a different bloody solar system
Oh pk the wonders of men! When all you want is a cup of tea and a good sob, with no more comment than 'yes darling I understand' and what do you get, you didn't want to be fussed over! pmsl
Still waiting for mine to cook me supper one night (We have been together for 14 + years and married for 10), so you can imagine how --hungry I am-- supportive mine can be.
I do think that they don't know what to do at times like this because they don't have much facility for empathy, its a girl thing - which is why mn exsists. Glad to hear things are sort of better.
Feeling a lot better today and dh is showing more interest in the treatment which is all I was really after I suppose.
Yep Soosy - I think mine cooked me dinner once about 12 years ago!!
Thanks for your support over the last few days all of you.
Off to the clinic tomorrow for day 2 scan to see whether I can start the oestrogen. Luckily AF arrived this morning - I was getting a bit worried I hadn't downregged properly as it was meant to be turning up on Saturday.
Glad AF has arrived PK! Its weird actually wanting AF to come isnt it? Typically late when you need it to come to move on..... Hope injections not too bad. Remember someone else's advice to ice?
Thanks for all your posts about our treatment options. (Esp Soosy reminding me about mature eggs and FSH etc) Have spoken to Serhal and will go for GIFT. Also managed to convince them to start down regging on sunday. So off to the clinic tomorrow to pick up the drugs - might see you there PK! Feeling much better about it now I have a plan and am not hanging around for another month waiting to start (Im not good at waiting). So EC mid feb by my calcs.
We moved into our house nearly 2 years ago and still my DH hasnt got a clue where things live in the kitchen...... his idea of cooking supper is ordering a curry.
I agree that men are from a different planet, esp where treatment is concerned. Also PSML at the 'dont want to be fussed over'!! Dh says he doesnt feel so involved in the treatment because he really doesnt have to do v much even though all of my time is spent living with side effects, trying to be hopeful, taking drugs, going to appointments, sorting out childcare for EC/ET, paying the bills and thinking about it. I get cross when I feel that Im doing it all alone (and he is always at work during the hard bits). But then we really need the money.....
Sticki - were you there this morning or did you just speak to PS on the phone? I was there this am so won't be tomorrow. Great that you've resolved the issue of which type of treatment to go for.
Yes it was me who said to ice - it really made a difference last time. I'm not starting to inject for maybe 10 days still - quite a different protocol to the fresh cycle where I think you inject on day 1 iirc.
I worked out that if everything goes to plan our ET would be at the weekend so I need a plan for childcare for ds that can include weekends...not sure what that will be!
PK childcare, can't dh stay outside the treatment room with ds? Find out from the hospital if it is possible. What about a weekend with the grandparents? They need not know why.
Sticki glad to hear that you are on your way, waiting is definitely the worst part, the waiting before and afterwards I don't really mind the middle bit at least you feel like you are doing something.
The first injection is the worst isn't it I always give myself a bruise, then I get better at it. Had a pen last time and this which is a revelation. First time doing icsi I had powder & water to mix with big needles and then swapping them over god what a palaver. Still have bigger needles for cetrotide, but I do 6 or 7 of those.
I hopefully will start injecting next week, if everything goes to plan. Have a fabulous acupuncturist, who has banished my cough, which was the tail end of my cold. So I am hoping she will work similar magic during my cycle and after.
Hi Soosy - totally agree the first injection is the worst and then it's not so bad after. I had to do all the mixing last time too - powder and liquid but apparently don't have to with the drugs this cycle for the FET. How does the pen thing actually work? Do you just press a button and the needle goes in and you don't have to see it happening?
I've been told by the clinic that although it's totally fine for children to be there at other times they shouldn't go for the ET...but maybe I can check. Also I really think dh wouldn't want to miss the transfer - he's so proud of the fact he saw ds on the screen when he was a few cells!
I wonder with an FET transfer whether they do them at the weekend anyway - I need to ask whether they do or perhaps they let you coast for a day or two? Anyone know what the norm is for Fet - they definitely do fresh transfers at weekends.
PK - was at clinic today (Thursday) so we wouldnt have bumped into eachother.
Am now going through protocol and diary trying to work out dates and childcare etc. I havent asked clinic about bringing DD to appointments so I cant help on that one. In my experience you can be there a while at transfers because there is always some faff about your bladder being too full/not full enough/things in the wrong place! etc. However, at the weekends the clinic is much more relaxed.
Luckily with GIFT you dont have the transfer on a different day but DH will have to take time off as I will be a bit more sore than usual apparently and have to have a general anaesthetic.
Soosy - glad you have a fab acupuncturist. I love my sessions and find it makes a huge difference to how I feel. It is meant to make a positive impact on success too so Im hopeful but hasnt work magic so far! (Hope this is your cycle)I find it really interesting talking to my acup woman as she sees so many women doing treatment etc she has lots of interesting experience.
Af due tomorrow and I think on its way, I have been vile to DS this eve, he has been playing me up but instead of distracting him, which i know i should do, I just said no way too much (feel very guilty). and to top it all I have started defrosting the freezer, the sort of thing I only do just before my period. Cleaning the house is another favourite too.
Friday a Bad day for af to start as I have to ring the hospital and try and arrange an appointment for the same day as I will have to start injecting on day 3 (sun). Always impossible to get appointment same day, although in the old days someone would always see you.
sorry pk with a pen you have a very fine needle and all the drug is in the pen you just dial the dose, prime the pen, jab it in and push the end, it's all really quick, and you get much smaller bruises!
Sticki Glad to hear you have a general for GIFT. I sometimes wonder whether a general would be better for IVF as you would be totally relaxed
Soosy, good news about the pen for injections. Last time around I had this auto injector kit - loaded everything into the pen, pressed a button and the needle shot out into you all by itself - so no need to actually jab a needle into yourself. This time round things have moved on apparently (!) and we will be using the pen thing with the dial on it, but it does mean sticking a needle into yourself. DH can do that, gives him something to do.
Good luck with getting an appt Soosy - I hate it when little things like that are so difficult.
I have my dates now I think - EC on 6th Feb, ET on 8th. I had to pay the treatement and drugs costs today and phoned up DH to tell him how much I was paying, and he said that we didn't need to go ahead! I think he was joking, but he really should have learnt from last time that I Have No Sense Of Humour when downregging. Not even a little bit. Still, I am much better downregging on the pill than using Buserelin, haven't felt any urges to stab anyone yet.
Onlyaphase I know what you mean about the lack of humour, but it is disgusting the amount they charge for the drugs esp when you find out hospitals do deals with certain suppliers and your drug isn't one of those then you pay a huge amount. My drug bill this time was about £650 but the time before last it was over £900 as I was using a different brand of FSH.
Sorry about my little pre af rant, just cross about NHS and what they will and won't treat.
Downregging on the pill sounds rather nice, i can't believe you have your dates already, my treatments always seem to be in the lap of the gods and it's not until about five days before EC do I have any idea when its going to be! Much easier for child care your way.
LOL at you two Sticki and PK...you'll have to wear little MN identifying badges if you ever go to the clinic on the same day!!
Soosy...hope you are feeling a little better today. X
Onlyaphase....looks like you and me will be very similar times. My EC is due on the 4th Feb although that is rather dependant on my final scan on the 1st...but if all goes to plan...that's the date!
Took my first progeserone pill this morning so now it's really really happening!!! HURRAH!
Great that you've started Coggy - I think it makes it much more real when you take the first tablet!
Yes Sticki we'll have to have a code - if I sneeze three times or something that means it's me! Or someone with a bad cold...
Does anyone know, if you have a negative FET, how long do you have to wait before you can do another fresh cycle? I guess it must vary by clinic but I'd like an indication so that if this one doesn't work I can work out when we could start again.
If this cycle doesn't work we will do one fresh I'm pretty sure, and quite quickly after but then after that we might stop. For a while at least.
Lovely day today - hope everyone is doing something nice.
Hi pk I think you just have to have one period between having treatment, but you are not going to need it! Plus you may have more that one FET from your bumper crop! I think you and sticki should wear red roses in your lapel and carry furled umbrellas, you could of course speak in really bad eastern european accents.
Coggy, Glad to hear you have started too, you feel like something really positive is happening.
I have my first scan on Monday and if everything ok I start my FSH injections. Hooray, feeling much better since af arrived properly today, was a bit of an emotional wreck yesterday all stressed about treatment.
Had a lovely day wandering in Windsor Great Park, we are thinking of maybe moving to there.
Hope everyone else had a good day. Bath time for DS.
Coggy - great you have started ..... roll on a positive result.
Impressed that you defrost the freezer and clean when you have pmt Soosy! I just want to lie on the sofa and eat choc (in between shouting at people). Hope AF turned up in order for you to get an appointment.
Pk - not sure about FET then fresh. But I wouldnt have thought you have to wait v long if you dont want to. I have found that although the clinic have 'rules' about having a break etc they dont seem to be set in stone and Ive been able to start new cycles quicker in the past. (Im very impatient!)
I start downregging tomorrow - primolut then the nasal spray next week. I know the lack of humour and other tasty symptoms will appear soon. Joy!
I got so cross yesterday that we have to do all this to get pg - for even the possibility of the amazing happening and we actually get a very elusive bfp. Everyone else I know seems to be able to get pg easy as pie with none of the drugs, cost, symptoms, worry etc. I cant help compare myself (silly I know, I should know better by now) with the other normal women who manage easily and just end up feeling crappy. But feeling fairly positive about the treatment - at least we are counting down to EC around 12 Feb and each appointment, tablet, spray or injection is constructive.
It's all such a pain in the backside isn't it Sticki? I've been looking at people with children over the past couple of days and thinking you lucky sods....most of you wouldn't even know what EWCM was!!!!!!
...Not the best thing to be thinking as you wander around Sainsburys I can tell you!!!!!
Soosy...Windsor is lovely. We try to go there a couple of times a year. Used to have an old great-aunt who lived there and went quite often.
Eugh EWCM - I remember all that ....and it was entirely pointless for me as it turned out I absolutely couldn't have got pregnant naturally! Remembering that temp charting each morning too!
Has been nice this weekend as have friends staying whose daughter was also via IVF and who have done an FET since (sadly it didn't work) so have had a sympathetic ear around!
Yeh Soosy - what is going on with your PMT defrosting. I think if I have it I slob around lazily.
Now Soosy who is to say that I don't wear a red rose in my lapel, carry a furled umbrella and talk with an Eastern European accent as a matter of course anyway?!?!
Don't you? (Actually what is a furled umbrella - might have to google that!)
PK and Sticki I just have this uncontrollable urge to clean and get organised just before af, its almost like my body knows I will be useless for a day or two! My mum was the same. PMSL, thinking of everyone in the waiting room at UCH dressed as Cold War spies! Don't know what's funnier that, or thinking of you two trying to guess who the other one is! Furled umbrella just means done up, I have spent my youth watching too many thrillers!!
EWCM, when we started trying people didn't write books about stuff like that. Infact it was v difficult to get any info at all and then we discovered v quickly, that like you PK it wouldn't have mattered if I had or hadn't!
Oh coggy, so you know Windsor quite well, perhaps I can pick your brains about the best areas, as it looks like we are going to give up London, before it gives up us! I can always come back to London for more IVF if needs be (God I hope not, really am v tired of all this.)
Had scan today D3 and started FSH injections, back on Friday to see how those follicles are growing.
One bit of weirdness though, When we were in Windsor we bumped into the Doctor (and his family) who delivered my DS and sat next to him for our lunch in Wagamama,is this a sign?........
How is it all going out there? Looks like you are all slightly ahead of us. Hope all the side effects arent too bad this cycle? Im in the quiet bit of downregging so no more clinic visits until late Jan/early feb. So, perhaps I'll just miss out on the fancy dress meetings in the waiting room with PK? (Maybe we should have a code like they do in bad spy movies......'the sun is shining in moscow' etc?)
Oooh noooo! Have just re-read my comment about 'better view this time' and thought about how that comes across. Im really really sorry soosy I hope you are not offended.... oops! my choice of words wasnt good. Really didnt mean to be rude.
I wish I could blame the drugs for my sense of humour!
Sorry sorry sorry! (Note to self - must preview messages before posting)
I did however meet him before the eventful night that was full labour and then emergency c section, and we got on really well, have seen him since as I was traumatised by the Nurses at my doctor's surgery doing my smear tests, so he does them for me privately, that sounds worse i'd better stop. Another weird thing; his houseman was the doctor that did the EC and ET that resulted in DS. This is all becoming a bit of the twilight zone, or am I showing my age?
How is all the downregging, do you downreg on the day one? When I used to Downreg it used to be D21 or in my case D23, I don't think my cycles were ever as planned as yours seem to be.
Off to watch Holby city, God you'd think I'd have had enough of hospitals.......
Hi all. How's everyone doing? Off to the clinic tomorrow to see how uterus lining is doing and whether I should start the injections.
Had a fab acupuncture appt on Sunday morning - once the needles were in I drifted off and was thinking about a baby which is exactly what happened last time - I'd never visualised it before the acupuncture. I was imagining a little girl. If this treatment works I have a 50% chance of declaring myself psychic and a 59% chance of deciding i am crazy.
I tried accupunture for quite a long time to balance myself after having my DS and ttc again. Thought I could probably do with quitre a lot of emotional balance as well as my poor old body not knowing what was going on!!!
I bruised quite badly once or twice so I didn't always find it as relaxing as it should be cos I was worried for my poor accupunturist who had to keep apologising!!! I bruise even by looking at the corner of a table!!!!!
I also used to always get a numb tongue.....is that normal....or just plain wierd??!!!! LOL!
Hi all Hope clinic appointments go well and lining/follies growing well?
Coggy - what are you up to?
Still downregging here and symptoms hitting me hard and I havent even started sniffing yet. Just taking progesterone pills then sniffing on sunday. Worst bit for me is just not being able to get to sleep even though Im shattered. The switch in my brain seems to go a bit astray during down regging. So makes me even more grumpy! Acne doesnt help the morale levels either! But all things considered (incl v naughty 2.5 DD) am keeping my chin up.
I had my drugs delivered today by a rather soggy courier guy. All seems rather real now, downregging on the pill isn't nearly as invasive and noticable as injecting buserelin daily. Should have baseline scan next Thurs, start stimming Friday.
PK - how's your uterus lining coming along? Am always staggered that they can tell so much from a grainy monochrome screen.
Coggy - I'm a little behind you I think as I now have confirmed dates of EC on 8 Feb, a little later than I thought before. Can't imagine getting that far, the consultant wasn't that optimistic about my ovaries. They have put me on a massive dose of FSH - drug bill for Puregon alone is about £2500.
Soosy - how did your scan go?
Hope you all have lovely weekends in the rain - hope nobody floods
, no patches etc, is this because of the pcos? make sure the big needle is for injecting it might be for mixing. I did have a couple of glasses of fizz with dh and ds as dh had reached his target at work, so hopefully good bonus next year!
