Hi all

At the moment my DD is taking around 30 fluid oz of formula and 6 of ebm (on a good day). She's almost six weeks old. Is she getting any goodness from the ebm even tho she gets loads more formula every day? (Hope so!)

Thanks!

All breast milk is good. She will be getting benefit from it even if it's a small amount, antibodies from you etc. Well done for keeping up with the expressing. Am presuming you wanted to BF and had problems?

Thanks! Have there been any studies to that effect? Does formula negate any of the good stuff (not to say formula isn't good stuff in its way!)? I do and have been bfing but every time I do it properly I get mastitis as my nipples are fucked a little on the sore and bloody side.

Argh! You poor thing, sounds v painful. Not sure of the research base for it, just something I was told when I first started BF. As far as I know most studies tend to look at women who exclusively BF compared with those who exclusively FF - I assume because it would get v complicated trying to work out how much BF/FF each baby was getting and the effects of that. Have you searched the archives on here? Lots of useful BF advice, it's where I get most of my info from! There's some real BF experts who know a lot more than I do with my measly 10 months of BF experience.
FWIW I don't see that formula would negate the effects of EBM, maybe just dilute them and TBH if you've had mastitis, pain, bleeding etc I'm just amazed you're still feeding and haven't just packed the whole thing in!
Have you spoken to a breastfeeding advisor about the problems you've had? I had really good BF advice and support but from things I've read on here not everyone is so lucky. Hope that's some help..and if nothing else bumping might attract the attention of someone more experienced

Sorry, DH hogged the computer yesterday!

Thanks IC - that's very reassuring. I was a bit worried while the mastitis brought my supply down to practically zero but I pumped almost 2 oz this morning which I'm very pleased about. I do plan to see an advisor - now I'm feeling more positive and in control of things hopefully it will be useful!

she is, or at least that's what they told me when i was in the same position. i was told to think of it as a live transfusion, which i really liked. all those good immunities coming through loud and clear. sure, diluted a bit, but still there in a way they simply couldn't be on formula alone. you're doing well to keep up the expressing, it's a pain in the arse. there are things that can be done, such as domperidone, to help that supply thing. i do hope you get the help you deserve.

Ta ATC. Have heard of domperidone and am currently guzzling fenugreek to see if that has any effect...

hiya lucy, its great that you are expressing, i am just about to start bottlefeeding ds4, i bfed the other three until they were three years and he is only 9wks, but is a nightmare feeder and i am exhausted so i have decided bottles are the way to go, but i shall express as i have gallons of milk and combine that with the formula for a while, i will prob gradually reduce my supply and do it that way, i dont think i could express for months, as i have the other three to look after and tbh i have had enough but its good to know that the bit he gets will help

have you tried puttinga warm flannel on your breasts when you express? that can help to stimulate supply and pump every three hours and once during the night time to stimulate your hormones more etc? its apita, but i know these things all help if thats what you want to do

good luck you are doing fab xxx

Hi, I expressed when I couldn't breastfeed for similar reasons, and also found it difficult to produce even half the amount needed, even with domperidone and fennel tea. Probably managed about 1/4 to 1/3, often less. The benefits of breastfeeding are mainly the immunities - ie your baby's health right now - and the possible longer term effects we hear about like IQ and obesity. Diluted, immunities are still immunities. If there's something about the long fat chains that affects the rate of brain growth in a way that fish oil doesn't, then again, I would guess that getting them at all, even in addition to something else, is going to help - like taking a supplement helps even with a poor diet. Which leaves increased risk of obesity - could that be caused by the fats in formula (eg, it is made with skimmed milk, which has been shown to have different effects from full fat milk, can't remember why) or the fats in breastmilk? The truth is, as far as we know at this point, genetics still has by far the biggest part to play in obesity, and breastfeeding is one of many elements shown to have an additional effect.

I know how tiring expressing is when you have a young baby to take care of. If you're managing okay, it will probably make you feel better emotionally to have given some breast milk, that's the truth, and as long as you're doing it, you're keeping the option open of getting back to breastfeeding, keeping your milk going, and you and your little baby may get it together with some help. But it is hard, and your baby has had six weeks of breastmilk, which is not nothing. My GUESS is that breastmilk's benefits can't be cancelled out, but I hope you work out what's best for you as well.

i always wonder if it's the unchanging nature of formula combined with the opportunity to routine feed that might account for the obesity thing? or was that confounded for?

I wonder. I wondered if it was the tendency to overfeed formula (which I did, not knowing what I was doing) that set the 'full-up' detectors/hormones at an early age. But it could be the types of fats that set up an impulse to store (or an impulse not to store). I think fatness is set by how the body makes insulin? Now I've been reading about how the plastic in bottles might cause obesity, in which case expressed breast milk would be the same! There are no end of things to worry about.